Making player levels private

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Should players be allowed to hide their mortal level, forcing other players to guess at their size?

Yes.
25
66%
No.
13
34%
 
Total votes: 38

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Cherek
Site Admin
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Re: Making player levels private

Post by Cherek » 18 Sep 2012 16:15

Amberlee: As I mentioned in the other thread we could decide to remove the overall rankings and just have weekly, if we want to. Appearing on the rankings is also optional even if we keep them as it is.

You think this will lead to huge myths killing considerably smaller players? I dont really follow. Why do you think that? As it is now we have almost no PVP at all? You think that would change dramatically if showing mortal levels was made optional? How come?

Amberlee
Myth
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Location: Kristiansund, Norway

Re: Making player levels private

Post by Amberlee » 18 Sep 2012 16:21

Because people in general are assholes if they can get away with it..
Yeah i know, im cynical.. Im also right.
The views posted by me on this forum is not the views of the character Amberlee in-game.
If you ask for my opinion here, you will get MY opinion, not that of my character.

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Cherek
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Re: Making player levels private

Post by Cherek » 18 Sep 2012 16:31

amberlee wrote:Because people in general are assholes if they can get away with it..
Yeah i know, im cynical.. Im also right.
But if they are what you say, what is stopping them from killing experts now? There's no rule against it and havent been for a decade or so.

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Kas
Legend
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Re: Making player levels private

Post by Kas » 18 Sep 2012 18:22

The positive side on this feature forces people to do direct comparsions ingame as the only means to get a bearing, and it adds probably more mystery since you no longer can track the progress of others over time. On the "negative" side, rules (if any) about small sized players being protected is probably forfeited.

How do a supermyth compare vs a titan, champion or a wanderer? If the supermyth sees no difference when comparing stats, a broader spectrum of engagements and ganks will, or may likely occur. Not necessarily bad thing, but that's something worth considering.
Might and Glory flaming for changing dawn, ancient power revealed of an iron crown, clear and cold and shining so far and bright, crush the world in one clash of your binding light.

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Arcon

Re: Making player levels private

Post by Arcon » 18 Sep 2012 18:53

I think that even with layman skills in appraise enemy you can see if a player is a lot bigger or a lot smaller then you, try it. I like having to use appraise enemy, it adds another feature/general skill to combat.
Last edited by Arcon on 19 Sep 2012 02:22, edited 1 time in total.

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Cherek
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Re: Making player levels private

Post by Cherek » 19 Sep 2012 01:52

Yeah... if you dont get any hints when you're "much smarter, much stronger much... etc" you'll definitely know you're attacking a small player when your first hit takes half their HP... that excuse for repeatedly killing considerably smaller players probably wont hold in court...:) And thats what the rules says, _repeatedly_ killing smaller players who cant defend themselves. So no, I really dont think it'll be a problem. "I didnt know he was small" isnt a good excuse efter you have killed the same small player several times anyway. Anyone who does that knows what they are doing. Titles or no titles.

But do we really have a problem with big players killing really small ones? Repeatedly? No we dont. And if it does happen _once_ its usually because the small player is mistaken for an npc. Like fairly recently when some old newbie happened to get killed in Green Oaks when a larger player moved through killing the small elf NPC. So if its not happening now, I really see no indication of that happening just because we add an option to hide your title.

No I think the main negative side to this is we risk losing the competition of becoming the biggest baddest player... and the pride to see "champion" behind your name in the who-list, and know you have worked hard for it. But my personal opinion is that it might be something worth losing for the potential gain of removing the need to grow huge, which is something alot of players have mentioned as a problem.

And no it wont "fix" the problem with big size differences, but it might hide it. Which in many cases can be just as good I think.

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Strider
Adept
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Re: Making player levels private

Post by Strider » 19 Sep 2012 02:33

Why won't this compound the problem when people just assume that every character, other than their own, is a myth?

It may be my recollection is faulty, but I believe that back in the champion days people had a pretty good idea how big everyone ones, some more numerically than others, and there was a big wizard purge over that fact.

I doubt this would improve the amount teaming, especially if some formal is added to cause some portion of our currently small player-base to be incompatible for teaming with other portions, as that seems to be tied entirely to experience acquisition efficiency and the belief that almost no one can off set their team cost.
The preceding collection of words was presented by Strider's Player.
Any meaning you ascribe to them is most likely due to lucky happenstance or your misinterpretation.

If you'd prefer Strider's opinion, you'll probably have to ask for it in game.

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Cherek
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Re: Making player levels private

Post by Cherek » 19 Sep 2012 02:48

strider wrote: It may be my recollection is faulty, but I believe that back in the champion days people had a pretty good idea how big everyone ones, some more numerically than others, and there was a big wizard purge over that fact.
I started playing just after or about when that purge happened, so I dont really know why it happened and what the result was. Probably most who are still around dont remember it, or barely do. Maybe you can tell us, since you're such an old fogey..:)

However after that purge, and I can only speak for myself course, I did not have a clue about how big other people were. Well you heard that some people like Kithkanan and Gector were huge but other than that... no clue. Nor did I use any of the popular ways to measure your size, like asking a wizard for average numbers or drinking X amount of this, carrying that, etc. And nor did I care. Also when I hit champion I basically stopped grinding and felt no stress to grow bigger. Of course I did grow anyway from teaming with people and sometimes grinding alone, but it was not the main goal, and I had no problem just standing around talking to people for my entire playing sessions. When I have played more recently I always felt that "stress" that if I am not making progress I am wasting my time playing.

I think hiding mortal levels could remove that "I have to make progress to grow and keep up"-stress that I think more people than me has felt or is feeling. That of course is just my personal opinion, and just because it says "Wizard" under my name it does not make it the correct opinion. I think it's an interesting idea though, one of the better ideas I have seen around here lately, both in terms of potential gain and in terms of possibility to implement it.

Draugor
Myth
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Joined: 06 Mar 2012 00:14

Re: Making player levels private

Post by Draugor » 19 Sep 2012 06:22

amberlee wrote:
Cherek wrote:
amberlee wrote: Not like we wont know who is big and not anyway.
Well you do now, and will for awhile. But a year or so from now we probably wont be so sure about everyone anymore.
Yeah we will.. For rankings and compare skill.
Compare may not be very accurate but even at noob levels it gives you a clue.

ALSO!

If you in fact are right, and people wont know.. You will have myths going around killing experts without consequence..
So yeah in retrospect.. changing my vote from yes to no.
People are already doing that due to the lack of pvp rules, I think the only rule we have is that you cant nuke someone twice in one day unless they come for retaliation right away right?

Makfly
Champion
Posts: 608
Joined: 04 Mar 2010 00:36

Re: Making player levels private

Post by Makfly » 19 Sep 2012 06:56

Cherek wrote:Yeah... if you dont get any hints when you're "much smarter, much stronger much... etc" you'll definitely know you're attacking a small player when your first hit takes half their HP... that excuse for repeatedly killing considerably smaller players probably wont hold in court...:) And thats what the rules says, _repeatedly_ killing smaller players who cant defend themselves. So no, I really dont think it'll be a problem. "I didnt know he was small" isnt a good excuse efter you have killed the same small player several times anyway. Anyone who does that knows what they are doing. Titles or no titles.

But do we really have a problem with big players killing really small ones? Repeatedly? No we dont. And if it does happen _once_ its usually because the small player is mistaken for an npc. Like fairly recently when some old newbie happened to get killed in Green Oaks when a larger player moved through killing the small elf NPC. So if its not happening now, I really see no indication of that happening just because we add an option to hide your title.
Have we had players leave the game due to the problem of gross imbalances and the serious implications it has on an FFA PvP game?
Oh yea, plenty of them, just trawl back on this forum and you can find testaments from those that posted about it before they left. How many more just left without posting about their frustrations and motives to ditch Genesis? Most I'd venture to say.
Cherek wrote:No I think the main negative side to this is we risk losing the competition of becoming the biggest baddest player... and the pride to see "champion" behind your name in the who-list, and know you have worked hard for it...
Haha...yea...sure..."hard work" indeed.
Cherek wrote:And no it wont "fix" the problem with big size differences, but it might hide it. Which in many cases can be just as good I think.
You're joking right?
No? Seriously...?

You (il)logic boggles my mind some times, Cherek.
Mortimor Makfly - Gnomish Xeno-Anthropologist

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