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Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 07 Aug 2013 20:07
by petros
Probably should add this to the game help, but I thought that I would make this explicit given the magic guild recodes that are going on.

Someone wearing armour protects against melee attacks. Someone with magic resistance protects against magical attacks. If you have no resistance, it is exactly the same as going into combat without any armour if you encounter a spellcaster.

We will gradually introduce more items with resistance benefits into the game. But for now, there are great resources in herbs, potions, and layman spells that you can use. That's in addition to imbuements and well-known armours and weapons.

Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 08:51
by Bromen
Does this mean an update to npc's as well? Or will a caster be able to overrun current npc's due to the lack of spell resistance on those targets?


Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 09:42
by Laurel
Was it ever any different, B.?

Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 10:20
by Hektor
I think that it will happen automatically as we shift to the new magic system. From what I have experienced several NPCS will be harder than before since most spells from the guilds in the old spell system used faulty or nonexistant check routines.

Many NPCs have resistances and wear gear which helps them resist spells. I strongly agree that several of them needs a look through though. Especially (and yes this is a coming nerf on myself I am imposing here ;) ) vis a vis certain elemental resistances in spells. I can certainly see all dragons, draconians and some area specific npcs (frost giants etc) needing an overhaul in that perspective.

Do we want elemental weaknesses though ;) Mmmm extra dmg from fire & acid spells against trolls anyone... *whistle innocently*

Also I second the notion that items that offer spell resistance or elemental resistance (and there are more out there than you think!!) should give some sort of notification (maybe we can set a standard object for res checks notifications in all resistance items & spells or something clever?) when they aid against spells or effects somehow. Then systematically go through all NPCs and objects domain by domain and make sure they are up to date.... ok maybe not the most interesting assignment but... ;)

What about smiths

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 11:12
by Zar

What about smiths with this change?
Will we be able to create armours with resistances?
Will we be able to get more details about what resistances by "sminspect"?

Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 13:23
by Kas
There is alot of resistances out there already, and we experienced some flucturations on certain mobs that made them much much harder overnight. We probably expect the trend to continue in both directions (immune stuff becomes killable, too easy stuff harder etc).

Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 19:10
by Celephias
As an interesting anecdote, the frost giant in terel absolutely doesn't respond well to fire. This seems intuitive and reasonable. Others (like certain dragons) are all but immune to fire. If your spells are based on fire, those become basically unkillable for you. This is the voice of experience in both cases.

Also, where armour helps reduce, but doesn't completely negate damage from melee, I would expect resistances to act similarly. So just because you have an item that gives you X resistance, doesn't mean you take no damage from X. I suspect resistances will be capped as well, much as armours are.

I think an interesting discussion topic is the comparison between finite nature of mana versus the comparatively unlimited nature of weapon attacks and specials from melee types. Assume two comparable people PvPing have the best gear to negate each other (best armour / best resistance gear). I'd expect the spellcaster to stand there are long as they could casting at the melee type. Would we expect the spellcaster to be able to kill the melee type emptying the tank or would it be a matter of once you see great resistance gear, run away because you can't do enough damage even if you used all your mana? Of course its also likely that they could get wimpied away beforehand. In most cases, I would believe the encounter is short one way or another.

I'm interested in people's perspectives on how these things should/could work.

Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 19:44
by Laurel
I have yet to see any resistance level that would stop ppl from dying if they get more than 1 BB, or BB+stat cloud ;)

Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 19:48
by Kas
1 manabar gives you a maximum potential of spelldamage you can ever inflict upon a target with 0% resistance/absorb. A melee has unlimited potential. 90% resistance gives the max potential of the casterat 10%, while the melee facing the same still has an unlimited potential. Therefore, it is possible for a caster to land in a situation where he never can break the tank of the enemy and defaults at loss.

We experienced this with targets packing sufficiently resists I believe.

Re: Game Mechanic: Resistance (Magic) == Armour (Melee)

Posted: 08 Aug 2013 19:53
by petros
Before things get too carried away... a few points:
  • Yes, resistance in general has been a problem in Genesis. Some domains massively upped resistance to counter effects from caster spells. Others completely ignored resistance
  • All recoded caster guilds will correctly check resistance. It's centralized now, so guild wizards can't just go and ignore resistance checks like in the past
  • Given the correct checks are now happening, we have to undo/rollback years of "gaming" of the resistance system. This involves mortals bugging specific npcs and us going through and fixing them. The alpha/beta testing so far has yielded some fixes already.
In other words, we understand that there is tons of history behind people not trusting resistance checks, etc. But the only way we can fix all of this is with help from people who are testing. Much like how we changed herbs to heaps recently, it may result in some breakages, but we are confident that we can get to everything eventually.