Non-flamey Size Discussion

[Dorrien]

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[Cerin]

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[Dorrien]

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[Cerin]

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[Tarax the Terrible]

By the way.
Here is food for thought.

You can go from novice to myth in less than 4 months.
Of course you have to be a bit obsessive and have SOME form of help to get you started, but it is possible.
Within a year you can be high on the overall web rankings and be bigger than some of the oldtimers on said rankings.
Again you have to be a bit obsessive.

So playing the game for so many years and not growing past hero and whining about everyone else being so much bigger.
That is to me just surreal.
You choose to make an effort, or you choose to spend your days in sparkle church.
In the end though it is exactly that, a choice.

A bit obsessive..

In order for that to be realistic you have to be a power player extraordinaire.
It is quest so hard you never get above meek.
Then brute up and I really seriously doubt 4 months is doable solo.
With really serious Leeching yeah maybe, but still mind boggling.

I think you are pretty off base on the slamming ppl who are stuck in a rut around hero tho. Or titan or champ or legend. They just said knights are struggling for huge players in the guild.
So its not going to be like they can hop into a daily Icewall / Mithas / Terel / Repeat Grind fest.
Some of the players you are talking about have probably never even been in a top notch grinding party. Without which a lot of the big players would have been in a similar situation.

I'm not moaning about myself btw. I have been lazy and wasn't overly worried about making progress. Just getting my kicks where I find them. Might do a bit more dedicated power playing now I am in the mood.

[Dorrien]

It most definitely takes EFFORT. I think that is the point. I too once thought hey let me get myth easier man!! But it really isn't a huge matter of easier but more effort from player. I have stated I have NEVER been myth and I am advocating for it staying as hard or harder. To me it is watering down achievements to appease newer players who are used to games that all offer single track paths to max level and the game doesn't open up UNTIL you hit max level. This is not that game. The game was and is open to all levels at day 1. Baby Orcs in Cadu can get you going if need be.

[Cerin]

It most definitely takes EFFORT. I think that is the point. I too once thought hey let me get myth easier man!! But it really isn't a huge matter of easier but more effort from player. I have stated I have NEVER been myth and I am advocating for it staying as hard or harder. To me it is watering down achievements to appease newer players who are used to games that all offer single track paths to max level and the game doesn't open up UNTIL you hit max level. This is not that game. The game was and is open to all levels at day 1. Baby Orcs in Cadu can get you going if need be.

I think the issue is new players dont have the experience or know how that some older ones do. They dont have zmud/cmud and know how to set up scripts, they havent had to mess with the syntaxes over and over to understand what works and what doesnt. My biggest thing is what purpose does a soft cap serve other then to see how large you can get? Why does it have to be stats? Why cant people compete for guild exp? It should take effort yes, but not at the expense of fun. Which this is what a games main purpose should be, fun.

I just cant see the benefits of the current model vs many many other different models out there.

[Dorrien]

Cerin, to me it is everything that you listed, the countless SYNTAX BATTLES the endless tweeking of triggers and eventually scripts. It was all the shit we went through that made this game what it is to each of us. It really isn't "I had to go through all of this, you should too". I couldn't care less if everyone got bumped to Myth but me, I am on my grind. It is more so, the game already has SO MUCH MORE in it than it did, embrace it for what it is now and know that eventually we love it for all the reasons we hate it. Tutorial Island, need I say more? I LOVE it, but I joined before it and entered this world truly in the dark. I have never seen a time where players reach Hero or Titan faster than right now, so to me it seems like things are rather nice for new players right now. I may be out of touch with new players though, they only EVER interact with me via a mail to sign a damn book.

[Cerin]

Cerin, to me it is everything that you listed, the countless SYNTAX BATTLES the endless tweeking of triggers and eventually scripts. It was all the shit we went through that made this game what it is to each of us. It really isn't "I had to go through all of this, you should too". I couldn't care less if everyone got bumped to Myth but me, I am on my grind. It is more so, the game already has SO MUCH MORE in it than it did, embrace it for what it is now and know that eventually we love it for all the reasons we hate it. Tutorial Island, need I say more? I LOVE it, but I joined before it and entered this world truly in the dark. I have never seen a time where players reach Hero or Titan faster than right now.

Most of those reaching that are because of the updated quest guide, the hand holding through quests and platforms like the old Skype Chat and Discord. Which is great, don't get me wrong people are able to level up much quicker then 10 years ago.

My whole issue again is with the is it really better for the game? Why does it have to be stats that everyone competes for? Why cant we cap it at Supreme in all stats and everyone grinds for absolutely anything else you can think of. Other then something that directly impacts combat? There are 20 different things I can list off the top of my head players could grind 20 years for but why are we sticking with stats? Because it gives players a distinct superior advantage over others and they enjoy that feeling. But that feeling doesn't apply to those smaller then them.

Such as the Knights, I love using them because its a group of all new players who are extremely small trying to have fun. Bar maybe Chade, Greneth, Alisa and Faryan. Three of which are off and on and one of which just quit the game over all this. They got a letter from the PoT that said, die or war. So because they enjoy RP they went to war, Knights dont surrender their leader to PoT. Now you have Super Myths hunting Expert-Heros with a few off and on Champ-Titans. They've asked for help from councils I believe, but no one said yes. Because no one else wants to PvP. Because no one else wants to die and lose their levels. So what are they suppose to do? Abandon RP and just die at the whim of a bigger player? Give up and leave the guild? Keep fighting and be unable to quest and grow bigger?

Mind you this was a dead guild before a bunch of new players came and decided to bring it back to life. But it all comes back to the same thing, every single time and in every single situation. Size. Its always about size. So what do you do? Tell people to just ignore those guilds until they are Myths? In my mind, thats not a very good game model and I think we can come up with something better.

[Johnny]

Woah, how did my name get thrown in here. Yes, I told you it was a bad decision to fight a Myth in a guild I know I basically no NOTHING about. I know the type of player you were plotting to kill and, yeah, I'm not getting involved with that one bit. I know why one of my characters was kicked from a guild when I was helping out a friend. *peer grudgingly Cerin*

Anyways, when I first started playing I used telnet. Nuff said. I learned from other players and, I know this may sound bizarre but, I did some reading and spent COUNTLESS hours in the help files of Zmud/Cmud to LEARN what I know and then shared it with my close friends. When I didn't know something I asked questions from friends not strangers. So when it comes to the scripting and setting up triggers, it took me 14 years to get where I am. I'm not and I'm not even CLOSE to how some others have setup their clients.

Now... growth. Myth is earned not given, I think it should be harder to hit myth. I do agree with Nils though! Rework the brutality system! I also agree with Dorrien, put a cap on how many times you can stack deaths! It's unreal how fast people grow their titles now. 10 link blademaster in a matter of a month or two?!?! Something is broken here... Finish guild recodes!

The game as come a LONG way since I started. I don't remember how I manage to even create a character. The mirrors were quite confusing for my first text-based MMO. Also, there was hardly any newbie areas. It took people, like Ody, that helped me out and taught me the ropes. I just happened to take notes so I didn't have to continually feed off a knowledgeable player. There is something to be said about a player who will still use pencil and paper to makes maps and jot down notes.