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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 07:27
by gorboth
Good ideas coming in.

So far I really like the idea of dis making cool team things possible. I wonder if that is something we could develop. And, no, I don't want to just ape the existing abilities of guilds like the Knights or Calians.

Also, I would not want to just make it based on the raw value of your stat. Rather, I'd like to make it something like if your dis is higher than your stat average, then you have the advantage. So only people who actually make dis a priority get the benefit.


Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 08:40
by Tarax the Terrible
Ody wrote:
Tarax the Terrible wrote: <order tarax advance>
<order gorboth fallback>
So essentially you suggest making Knight rescue universal? I oppose this for the obvious reason. I like the idea of a fatigue and health recovery morale system though.
It used to be there for mercs.
If you want a big effect / bonus its something to consider.

Its different to rescue, rescue splits the attackers.
Good for confusion in PvP but easily countered.

The special im referring to also took quite a long time to work.
Other guilds r instant.

If knights are the only hard done by guild then give them a morale bonus.

Move behind personally I think its real value is in PvP, that the target is safe for a while after.
Funny that they learned this trick from orcs

Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 08:49
by Tarax the Terrible
If old merc specials are a no go cus the goodies r too precious about being the only side to have anything of the sort.
The next obvious thing is haste bonuses. Which is a pesdo exp bonus.
Defending or Armour class bonus probably are also no go?

Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 09:02
by gorboth
Things I've considered on my own, or already discussed with wizards:
  • shave time off guild specials cooldowns via dis
  • dis determines hp/fatigue regen speed
  • dis gives + to all skills.

Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 10:29
by Chanele
Good suggestions.

Petros has already confirmed race modifiers are not a factor in guild balance. Many has expressed a wish to see a global balance in race perks, wizards and mortals alike, and this is a good opportunity to do that.

I suggest having dexterity and discipline to be factors in chance to hit/fumble. Anyone that has been involved in martial arts knows that if you hesitate or enter the ring with are screwed.

Goblins has reigned supreme since the nerf to dexterity and it is about time to even this out. I'm not a fan to nerfs since that affect game play, I would rather see a boost to other races to enhance theirs.

Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 10:51
by Drazson
First off, the group morale thing sounds awesome but morale could be a thing for the solo experience as well since... it is simply real, you have morale which counts towards stuff you do when alone as well. How is the question.

On Gorboth's ideas:

• Shave time off guild specials cooldowns via dis: Cool one but it could spell balancing havoc in case of guilds having significantly stronger specials than others and maybe even more importantly disabling specials. Do all guilds have an attacking special to benefit from this? Could work somehow but I'm not very knowledgable on specials to determine if there's a huge balancing issue or not here.

• Dis determines hp/fatigue regen speed: This is actually fair enough an effect but I don't think it really makes sense, I can't think of discipline having placebo medical effects. It could be a nice boost to discipline mechanically but it doesn't feel right to me.

• Dis gives + to all skills: I don't like this. Guilds should feel special when their training focuses on some skill(s) and they should not get punished for being sup guru at something and "losing" the possible discipline bonus because they are extremely good. Also, skill training levels are supposed to mean something. You are never a sup layman because you know nothing and are disciplined enough to reach it, similar to the above. However, I see merit in an inverse function of this:

How about higher self/team morale than enemy's self/team morale (number crunching intensifies) making the worse of the 2 suffer minuses at skills? Sounds like it makes sense since, while for me + skills shouldn't be able to be produced, - skills because you are not trying as much / aren't concetrated makes total sense. You don't guard as well so -5 def or whatever, not sure how good we want to make this.

On an entirely different schema, your discipline matters when you face somethinglof a certain difficulty or well scariness. I could win a chess game against my nephew even if I was at the same time eating listening to music and being blindfolded (which has actually happened). So! Scary/Difficulty factor to go against team/self morale instead of morale vs morale may work. For example, someone right off Tutorii happens to fight someone on the level of Witch king of Angmar. Whazzup there? Compare (combat only?) stats (maybe leave discipline out) and skills (number crunching intensifies enough to almost create a black hole) to opponent's to create a difficulty factor. Then reduce the effect of that factor according to your discipline.

I hope what I just wrote is understandable cause I myself am peering quizacally at my post.

Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 11:50
by Tarax the Terrible
Don't get me wrong.
Set focus physical stats should be the way to go for fighters.

That mental are then under used I don't really care. Fighters physical stats should be the huge part of the equations.

Caster guilds are all ready extremely powerful. And more inclined to buff mental stats.

I am curious why G did not immediately think of dis having a bonus for mana recovery.

Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 18:25
by gorboth
Tarax the Terrible wrote:I am curious why G did not immediately think of dis having a bonus for mana recovery.
Because that is what wis does.


Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 18:46
by Kwevin
How about giving a little haste?? Like the idea of having +skills, that's what would happen. Was thinking maybe +parry or defence.

Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Posted: 19 May 2017 19:46
by Alisa

It should not, in my opinion be specific on something that is already designed.
-Skills are taxed in guilds....
-Specials are designed on stats, and taxed in guilds.
-STR,DEX,INT,WIS,INT have specific purposes.
-regen is based on con or wis(some claim a bit of skills as well)

What strangeness can DIS do, that nothing else really does, without mucking up balance.
Either it must affect all, or something entirely different.
Affecting specials will be a nerf to Dragonarmies, and a boost to knights. Mucking with balance. Also for those that are not goblin!

Making DIS aid regeneration, both health and mana, would increase dwarf power, and lower goblin supremacy. Elves would become even worse warriors.

Now, if we think on what DIS means. Discipline. What effects does discipline have in the word.
-You can decide your own actions
-You can keep enduring hardness
-You have the ability to set a path towards a goal

That is what i associate with Discipline. What affects those in-game.
-Guildstat, stats and size. Already organized.
-Hitpoints, mana, fatigue. Already organized.
-Well, players discipline(or lack of) :-)

What i see not happening because of wizard time:
-It could be used to resist guild abilities that dictate actions. Spells that create panic, and all those(rewriting spells, not going to happen).

What i believe could be easily done by a wizard with access:
-Increasing the gain of guildstat(a disciplined mind learns faster) - I assume the basic xp system can be tweaked to do this, otherwise its a no-no as i dont see anyone rewriting all guilds.
-Decrease cost of learning/improving(very small effect for hardcore players, but gain for newcomers)
-Affect trading skill, earning more coins.(Dwarves will rule rclist)
-General magic ressistance(very small effect, could easily become way to powerfull.)