Brainstorming: Dis

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Thalric
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Thalric » 20 May 2017 10:24

If it isn't a matter of trying to preference stats elsewhere than into the usual ones, then this ought to be called "Brainstorming: dwarves", because they are likely going to be the only ones that are going to get a bonus, if dis is needed to be over stat average.

And do you really think dwarves as a race is that bad?

I thought it was a matter of giving people another stat to focus on, in order to be able to get something else than what is possible now.
And if you choose a race where you know that will never be possible, why would you even bother?
If you, like I suggested, let it be a matter of how you specialize yourself, it will be achievable for everyone, and we might just see some goblins or elves that are not as crazily specialized in either physicals or mentals.

Rincon
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Rincon » 20 May 2017 22:39

Well, my dis is definitely higher than my stat avg, so I would love to see my special's cooldown decreased. I could chop-chop-chop with my great waraxe like a sushi master :D

I think high dis should help you hit your opponent harder. After all, if you're brave, you're confident and don't back down, you press your opponent. You can even intimidate him by your undaunted posture.

Kwevin
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Kwevin » 20 May 2017 22:54

Discipline could help with panicking and specials. You could make it so that a disciplined person can press forward more easily, in all types of situations. Combat, helps brute force or removing stuns. Shops, better sell price, because bargainin.
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Habiki
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Habiki » 21 May 2017 06:19

I agree that discipline should have additional benefits.
For smaller people it already makes sense to want to
have higher discipline because they want to attack
bigger enemies, especially in a team. But once you
get to heroic DIS or so, you can pretty much attack
anything and from that point it makes no sense to
focus on DIS.

Secondly, I believe the reward would need to be
significant to combat, or else no one is going to
sacrifice their other stats.

Thirdly, I think higher than stat-average is a simple and
practical way to implement this. Truthfully, speaking
about the way stats work and race-modifiers a function of
percentage, only humans, hobbits and dwarves would readily
be able to achieve higher DIS than stat-average. Since other
races improve DIS slower, it would be an impractical use of
their stat-points. For larger players who are humans or hobbits,
it would still require significant restating to be able to attain
higher than average-stat DIS.

QUESTION TO DWARVES OUT THERE: You assumeably aren't
focusing on DIS. Is your DIS stat currently
higher than your average stat? Rincon says so.

Yes, this would be a buff for dwarves, but it really
doesn't seem fair for a dwarf's bonus to go towards a stat
that isn't useful.

Lastly, I believe the reward should be something
very logically related to the definition of discipline.
The best ideas I've heard so far include the following.

Minor effects:
- Reduced stuns
- Sell price
- Fatigue regen
- Reduced panic
- Skill training cost

Major effects:
- Special cooldown
- Parry ability (I'd like to also suggest an ability
similar to Calian Riposte where a parry is turned into
an attack)
- Skill bonus

PS: I don't think I would focus on DIS even if I got all
those minor effects listed above, although I am curious
about Anfalas stating that panic affects combat.

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Tarax the Terrible
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Tarax the Terrible » 21 May 2017 12:07

I have supreme physicals and heroic dis.
Focused heavily from the start.

Only two things currently are making me consider putting anything (ever) into dis.
1 being able to attack barash-gund, the yeti is about the only other thing in the realms I don't have dis to attack but it is aggressive. There might be obscure others but nothing that gets killed regularly for sure. Balrog I can get in the fight
2 getting to myth a lot faster if I dump some exp in a faster to raise stat

Having dis give names memory boost, regen boosts mana included would be nice bonus for all.
I liked the team commands idea and think it is short sighted of the goodie guilds to try and block it, as it would help them too in many cross teaming situations. Knight rescues then can move back. Calians can tank some after they had all moved behind a knight neidar etc etc.

It might also stop evil guilds from wondering why only good guilds get team perks at the minute.
Knights boost teams dis.
Calians get extra attacks, I suggested same idea for DAs long before that but it didn't fly.
I think neidar get some defence thing too?
Some caster guilds can boost dis of others too.

Heck just scrap this idea and work on balancing team specials.

Ps Was a cool idea for a global knight die ability, considering they didn't know it was a thing.
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gorboth
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by gorboth » 21 May 2017 22:19

Habiki - excellent post. I appreciate you boiling down to best ideas so far. I agree with you on most things there.

Tarax - that last post was somewhat incomprehensible. No more beer tonight! ;-)

G.
Mmmmmm ... pie ...

Amberlee
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Amberlee » 21 May 2017 22:41

An addition to Habiki's suggestions I would also do this.

Give higher dis a chance to increase stun duration that you deal.
The views posted by me on this forum is not the views of the character Amberlee in-game.
If you ask for my opinion here, you will get MY opinion, not that of my character.

Rincon
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Rincon » 22 May 2017 10:02

Minor effects:
- Reduced stuns
- Sell price
- Fatigue regen
- Reduced panic
- Skill training cost

Major effects:
- Special cooldown
- Parry ability (I'd like to also suggest an ability
similar to Calian Riposte where a parry is turned into
an attack)
- Skill bonus
I can agree with reduced stuns. You're brave and not willing to give in, but perhaps this is also a matter of strong will rather than bravery?
Sell price? No. I think that bargaining should depend on your int/wis.
Fatigue regen? No. Con does that. How can being brave help regenerate your fatigue? Doesn't sound logical to me.
Skill training cost? No. Why?

Special cooldown? Yes. Why? I don't know :P
Parry ability? Sure, why not. But why being brave makes your parry more/better?
Skill bonus? What sort of skill bonus?

All my ideas boil down to nerfing players with low dis, i.e. goblins. Low dis = higher panic levels = wimpying from fight even when fvw. In all fantasy books I know, goblins are a cowardly race and fight better only when they outnumber their enemies. Or low dis = losing one round of attack because you're too scared to strike your foe (you hesitate).

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Habiki
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by Habiki » 22 May 2017 10:36

I think the word discipline is distinct from bravery, although in Genesis it is essentially bravery. I've always preferred the definition of discipline as something like "knowing WHAT should be done and WHEN it should be done and then doing it."

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nils
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Re: Brainstorming: Dis

Post by nils » 22 May 2017 13:15

I remember "way back when.. " the theory was that the "You feel calm again."-messages that frequented battle spam was a chance for a bonus attack. We later learned this wasn't the case, but it makes sense to implement just that.

The jist of it would be: The higher the dis the more frequent the message. For every message you get another white hit or harder white hit. The important part is that there's already a system in place, which could be built upon.
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