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Brainstorming: Dis 
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Myth

Joined: 06 Mar 2012 00:14
Posts: 1651
mallor wrote:
Mim wrote:
mallor wrote:
How is this going to be balanced on AA side?
Don't goblins already have a stat edge vs dwarves in dex bonus?




Isn't it already balanced on guild level, because Neidars tank better? I could understand if you were talking back when DEX was king, but it's far from it now.



Not all dwarves are neidar tho :P Sadly dex is alot less usefull as it is now, the stats should be alittle better balanced, or preferably the races should be balanced, the admin are beeing surprisingly pig-headed on this tho.


21 Sep 2017 18:09
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Wizard
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Joined: 03 Mar 2014 13:03
Posts: 139
Location: US West
gorboth wrote:
Thematic justification:
Code:
A disciplined individual takes care of their gear - taking the time to inspect
it regularly for wear and tear, sharpening and oiling blades, sewing and
mending as needed. Additionally, a disciplined warrior does not hack with
impunity in battle, knowing that certain types of strokes are more likely
to blunt or break a weapon, but instead use correct technique and finesse
so as to maintain the effectiveness and quality of the item.

Balance considerations:
Code:
Zero decay on items might seem like a problem. However, this would only
be for players who decide that they want to sacrifice other very meaningful
stats to achieve this benefit. They would be pumping their exp into a stat
that does not make them fight any better, but instead makes their items
last longer. Thus, I feel it is perfectly acceptable to reward them with
such an extreme benefit.

Additional:
Code:
Also, new players would start with dis very close or equal to their
average, while older players would likely not have this as easily. Thus,
we do at least one thing that benefits younger players over older players
unless the older players really work hard to achieve it.


I appreciate seeing some of this thought spelled out while it's still in the idea stage.

Another idea I had is for there to be a similar benefit for Blacksmiths. Yes, we can repair our own armours, but frankly it takes longer than having Bubba do it. Additionally, repairing our own armour is exhausting so as a tank I can only repair 3-4 items without having to stop and rest (thus taking even longer). If you are looking at adjusting the code, would it be possible to add a check for Blacksmiths (with a rank qualifier/multiplier)?

  • Thematically, wouldn't blacksmiths know how to take care of their armour and reduce wear? Also, the crafted equipment from Blacksmiths is, frankly, pretty trashy at higher levels even if a smith has taken the hundreds (or thousands) of hours to perfect it.
  • Balance, most bigger players (that I've met) seem to be Gardeners or Mariners. There are not many that are Blacksmiths these days and the threshold for armour maintenance could be set at a fairly high level (Accomplished Titles only?). New players would already be getting the armour maintenance bonuses from discipline, and it would take any player a LONG time to get to the Accomplished Titles.
  • Additionally, there is not currently a guildmaster for the Smiths and as far as I know they haven't been looked at in a LONG time so maybe they would get some other love from wizards to make them, and all of the occupational guilds, more relevant.


21 Sep 2017 18:38
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Rising Hero

Joined: 27 Jun 2011 13:20
Posts: 371
Draugor wrote:
Not all dwarves are neidar tho :P Sadly dex is alot less usefull as it is now, the stats should be alittle better balanced, or preferably the races should be balanced, the admin are beeing surprisingly pig-headed on this tho.


Well not all gobos are AA, and not all AAs are gobos :)
Still for the sake of argument, you do agree Neidars are better tanks than AA?
If such, giving them much more durable armours will only increase that gap?
I'm all for making stats useful, but not if it brings even more disballance.


21 Sep 2017 19:56
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Site Admin
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Joined: 03 Mar 2010 20:51
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Draugor wrote:
Not all dwarves are neidar tho :P Sadly dex is alot less usefull as it is now, the stats should be alittle better balanced, or preferably the races should be balanced, the admin are beeing surprisingly pig-headed on this tho.

A redo of race stat mods is also in the works. We'll see if we can get to something all the Admin feel good about such that it can be implemented.

G.

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21 Sep 2017 20:01
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Myth

Joined: 06 Mar 2012 00:14
Posts: 1651
mallor wrote:
Draugor wrote:
Not all dwarves are neidar tho :P Sadly dex is alot less usefull as it is now, the stats should be alittle better balanced, or preferably the races should be balanced, the admin are beeing surprisingly pig-headed on this tho.


Well not all gobos are AA, and not all AAs are gobos :)
Still for the sake of argument, you do agree Neidars are better tanks than AA?
If such, giving them much more durable armours will only increase that gap?
I'm all for making stats useful, but not if it brings even more disballance.


HGhahahahhah!!! Oh god yes, Neidar tank alot better, AA does 2-3x the damage tho :P Neidar are NOT a damage powerhouse xD
IMo it's a bad way to use dis tho, imo, high dis might make you have the balls to make critical hits due to you taking the risk to score a massive fucking hit. Int/WIS could be used to counter those kinda moves by people noticing in aforehand and this... well yea counter it.


21 Sep 2017 20:36
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Great Adventurer
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Joined: 06 Mar 2010 14:39
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Draugor wrote:
Sadly dex is alot less usefull as it is now,


Not compared to DIS I hope.
And is it less useful? Is it it rather not 'not king of combat stats' as it used to be?

How much guild skills and specials should be included in this topic is not for me to decide.
But the discussion really should be on a global lvl adressing stats and race modifiers and their usefulness on a global basis.

If guild A or B, is more strong with skills and specials, is perhaps another topic.
I do strongly belive that a goblin have a big edge still when it comes to stat modifiers for a fighter, even if that is a very subjective thought.

Luckily, the game is more than combat.

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21 Sep 2017 20:39
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Site Admin
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Joined: 03 Mar 2010 20:51
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Location: Some old coffin
Mim wrote:
Luckily, the game is more than combat.

The "long game", sadly, is often not much more than lots and lots and lots and lots of PvE combat. Roleplay, guild politics, PvP wars, etc do play a role, but they take a lot less of the time spent in the game for many players.

Making dis reward somthing that supports combat, but is not combat itself ... well, I think that's pretty cool, too.

G.

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21 Sep 2017 21:28
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Rising Hero

Joined: 27 Jun 2011 13:20
Posts: 371
Mim wrote:
I do strongly belive that a goblin have a big edge still when it comes to stat modifiers for a fighter, even if that is a very subjective thought.


In a simplified Genesis with no guilds with only races, sure. But once we put it into guilds and sides context, it's way off the truth.


21 Sep 2017 21:39
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Great Adventurer

Joined: 30 Aug 2017 19:55
Posts: 150
gorboth wrote:
Draugor wrote:
Not all dwarves are neidar tho :P Sadly dex is alot less usefull as it is now, the stats should be alittle better balanced, or preferably the races should be balanced, the admin are beeing surprisingly pig-headed on this tho.

A redo of race stat mods is also in the works. We'll see if we can get to something all the Admin feel good about such that it can be implemented.

G.


This post just made me smile, please don't drag it out for years to come! :-D


22 Sep 2017 03:50
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Wizard
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Joined: 22 Sep 2014 13:15
Posts: 425
Greneth wrote:
gorboth wrote:
Draugor wrote:
Not all dwarves are neidar tho :P Sadly dex is alot less usefull as it is now, the stats should be alittle better balanced, or preferably the races should be balanced, the admin are beeing surprisingly pig-headed on this tho.

A redo of race stat mods is also in the works. We'll see if we can get to something all the Admin feel good about such that it can be implemented.

G.


This post just made me smile, please don't drag it out for years to come! :-D


Gorboth and I are both keen for it to happen. Right now the conceptual model is being discussed, and we are looking at an approach that is balanced and provides players a bit more self-determination on the stat modifiers that impact them. So try and maintain racial distinction, but also make sure race choice doesn't limit class playstyle as much as it currently does (i.e. Feeling obliged to be a certain race to optimise the guild class you decide to play).

Anyway, what we are proposing is a big change. It will impact everyone, so we aren't going to rush it (or are we?).


22 Sep 2017 04:50
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