Bringing back old guilds and the forums rules
Posted: 01 Aug 2017 06:19
I split this topics from another thread since the discussion derailed:
About bringing back guilds,
While I was AoD there were several requests to bring back various dead guilds (pun intended), and before I joined the admin I generally felt "YES" about every idea that spoke about bringing back old legendary guilds like the AA (back when they were closed), WoHS, Khiraa, Vampires, Mystics, etc. However, after joining the admin and being faced with these questions for real, I had to seriously consider the pros and cons of trying to bring back old guilds, and I came to the following conclusions:
1. First of all, while it may seem easier to build on something that already exists, it's often actually much easier to just build your own thing from scratch than try to understand old code someone else wrote decades ago, with little or no documentation. So from a technical point of view, you're probably more likely to fail trying to resurrect a guild than to create a new one. Unless you're the original creator of course, but those are generally not around anymore.
2. Expectations. Players have so amazingly HIGH expectations of these old legendary guilds. Unless you're a very experienced wizard (Arman for example) you're in for a very daunting task of trying to live up to the hype, and there's a big risk people will be disappointed despite your best intentions.
3. Balance. Do we really NEED guild X? Even if it was the coolest guild ever, if it leads to a very imbalanced guild setup, it might not be worth it. For example there was a request to try to bring back Khiraa at a time not long ago when Arman had not returned (No SoHM or WoHS planned), the EC was put on ice, and the Cult of Chemosh was the only other guild in the works. Bringing back Khiraa could have meant we would soon be looking at no less than four evil caster guilds (Cult of Chemosh included), against just one goodie (in need of a recode). That just did not seem like a good idea at the time, regardless of how cool Khiraa was. And they were pretty cool!
4. Old fond memories. It's like doing a remake of an old movie from a time when you grew up. It just isn't the same. AA is a great example of a guild that mainly became legendary because of its members, and the time period, and the events that took place back then. And when it finally was resurrected, the times had changed, Genesis had changed, and so had its players. I am not saying the current AA is a failure, or that it was a bad idea to bring it back, but it's no secret the new AA has had trouble living up the glory of the past (Sorry Avatar). It would be really fun to turn back time to Genesis 1997, but we can't. And bringing back other old guilds will most likely not turn back the time either. I think often a completely new guild has a higher long term chance of success, than the reopening of an old guild that will enjoy a huge nostalgia spike when opening, but it's not a guarantee it will last.
So, I kind of changed opinion along the way. The player in me still wants to see all those cool old guilds back, but the logical and practical side of me feels that unless it's exactly the right wizard, and the game really needs that type of guild in question, then it's probably best to let them remain buried, and think of new cool things, instead of trying to bring back old fond memories to life again. That rarely works. Not in life, and not here as history has shown.
We'll see how it goes with the WoHS! Feeling the pressure Arman?:) Nah, just kidding, I was the AoD who approved it after all, because in that case I do think the SoHM and WoHS was/is exactly something that Genesis really needed/needs, and Arman being exactly the right person to make it happen.
Anyway, just my personal thoughts, it's entirely possible I am wrong of course, and a reopening of the Khiraa could be the best thing since sliced bread, or that "fourth time's a charm" could be true for the Vampires.
About bringing back guilds,
While I was AoD there were several requests to bring back various dead guilds (pun intended), and before I joined the admin I generally felt "YES" about every idea that spoke about bringing back old legendary guilds like the AA (back when they were closed), WoHS, Khiraa, Vampires, Mystics, etc. However, after joining the admin and being faced with these questions for real, I had to seriously consider the pros and cons of trying to bring back old guilds, and I came to the following conclusions:
1. First of all, while it may seem easier to build on something that already exists, it's often actually much easier to just build your own thing from scratch than try to understand old code someone else wrote decades ago, with little or no documentation. So from a technical point of view, you're probably more likely to fail trying to resurrect a guild than to create a new one. Unless you're the original creator of course, but those are generally not around anymore.
2. Expectations. Players have so amazingly HIGH expectations of these old legendary guilds. Unless you're a very experienced wizard (Arman for example) you're in for a very daunting task of trying to live up to the hype, and there's a big risk people will be disappointed despite your best intentions.
3. Balance. Do we really NEED guild X? Even if it was the coolest guild ever, if it leads to a very imbalanced guild setup, it might not be worth it. For example there was a request to try to bring back Khiraa at a time not long ago when Arman had not returned (No SoHM or WoHS planned), the EC was put on ice, and the Cult of Chemosh was the only other guild in the works. Bringing back Khiraa could have meant we would soon be looking at no less than four evil caster guilds (Cult of Chemosh included), against just one goodie (in need of a recode). That just did not seem like a good idea at the time, regardless of how cool Khiraa was. And they were pretty cool!
4. Old fond memories. It's like doing a remake of an old movie from a time when you grew up. It just isn't the same. AA is a great example of a guild that mainly became legendary because of its members, and the time period, and the events that took place back then. And when it finally was resurrected, the times had changed, Genesis had changed, and so had its players. I am not saying the current AA is a failure, or that it was a bad idea to bring it back, but it's no secret the new AA has had trouble living up the glory of the past (Sorry Avatar). It would be really fun to turn back time to Genesis 1997, but we can't. And bringing back other old guilds will most likely not turn back the time either. I think often a completely new guild has a higher long term chance of success, than the reopening of an old guild that will enjoy a huge nostalgia spike when opening, but it's not a guarantee it will last.
So, I kind of changed opinion along the way. The player in me still wants to see all those cool old guilds back, but the logical and practical side of me feels that unless it's exactly the right wizard, and the game really needs that type of guild in question, then it's probably best to let them remain buried, and think of new cool things, instead of trying to bring back old fond memories to life again. That rarely works. Not in life, and not here as history has shown.
We'll see how it goes with the WoHS! Feeling the pressure Arman?:) Nah, just kidding, I was the AoD who approved it after all, because in that case I do think the SoHM and WoHS was/is exactly something that Genesis really needed/needs, and Arman being exactly the right person to make it happen.
Anyway, just my personal thoughts, it's entirely possible I am wrong of course, and a reopening of the Khiraa could be the best thing since sliced bread, or that "fourth time's a charm" could be true for the Vampires.