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Bottchecks
https://www.genesismud.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4194
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Author:  Makfly [ 23 Nov 2017 18:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Cherek wrote:
Mallor: Yes, as per the rules, for being caught a second time half of his combat XP was removed, without recovery. If he like you say still is bigger than some fresh myths even after losing HALF of his combat XP, then image how big he was _before_ he lost it, and how much he lost. Irk lost years of grinding, ask him if you don't believe me.

If you dont think losing half your combat XP without recovery is hard, I'll be happy to demonstrate it for you. Just let me know and we can measure how long it takes for you to get back to your old size.:)

If botting requires no effort of the player, once it's set up. Then why would loosing half of what have been gained through no effort be much of a punishment?

Author:  Cherek [ 23 Nov 2017 19:38 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Makfly wrote:
Cherek wrote:
Mallor: Yes, as per the rules, for being caught a second time half of his combat XP was removed, without recovery. If he like you say still is bigger than some fresh myths even after losing HALF of his combat XP, then image how big he was _before_ he lost it, and how much he lost. Irk lost years of grinding, ask him if you don't believe me.

If you dont think losing half your combat XP without recovery is hard, I'll be happy to demonstrate it for you. Just let me know and we can measure how long it takes for you to get back to your old size.:)

If botting requires no effort of the player, once it's set up. Then why would loosing half of what have been gained through no effort be much of a punishment?


I find it highly doubtful that there are any players in Genesis who has gained all their XP through botting? And even with botting, it takes a lot of time to gain the size of Irk or similar. And I doubt it's as effortless as you think to grow big by botting. But if you feel removal of combat experience without recovery is not enough as punishment, then what do you think is?

Back when I was AoP we changed the "ultimate punishment" for botting from deletion to removal of all combat XP. I wanted to make the rules and levels of punishment more clear and I also felt deletions should be reserved for really serious things like sexual harassment, RL threats, and similar. Also, when deleting someone, the character still keeps all the XP gained by botting. Meaning that should the character be restored sometime in the future, perhaps pardoned by a new AoP a few years later, or due to some rule change, or "global pardon", like we did a couple of years ago, then everything gained through botting is also restored. Removing combat XP felt like a more fitting, and more permanent punishment. Now, we could of course first remove all combat XP and then delete them, but deletion still comes with another potential problem.

Deleting someone means either: A - they quit Genesis forever, meaning we lose a player. A cheating player sure, but also a player who perhaps could stop cheating, and learn from old mistakes. Or, B - they start over with a new character, and since we have no idea who that is, we can't check in now and then and see if they continue their botting behavior. I felt, and still do, that removal of combat experience is the most fitting punishment for the crime. It hurts a lot, but still gives the player a chance to stop botting and continue playing, and be more active, and most importantly the AoP team knows who to keep a closer look at.

I am not in the AoP team anymore though, so changing any botting punishments are not up to me, just providing an explanation about how we decided on the current punishments while I was AoP.

Author:  Irk [ 24 Nov 2017 01:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

mallor wrote:
Irk is back and he's still bigger than any average fresh myth out there.


whaaaaaat? I am small myth right now, why do you think i am bigger than average myth? :| There are tons of myths bigger than me. Yeah i am a bit bigger than fresh myth cuz i did some fants on this level.

Yup Morrison isnt yet on my previous size and for sure not on my previous exp level :P

Author:  Amberlee [ 24 Nov 2017 01:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Irk wrote:
mallor wrote:
Irk is back and he's still bigger than any average fresh myth out there.


whaaaaaat? I am small myth right now, why do you think i am bigger than average myth? :| There are tons of myths bigger than me. Yeah i am a bit bigger than fresh myth cuz i did some fants on this level.

Yup Morrison isnt yet on my previous size and for sure not on my previous exp level :P



So you want an applause for botting yourself to huge size? :P
tbh you should have been deleted.

Author:  Cherek [ 24 Nov 2017 01:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Amberlee: Then he would just have botted with a new character named Ork or something, and we would not know who to keep our eyes on!

Author:  Amberlee [ 24 Nov 2017 03:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Cherek wrote:
Amberlee: Then he would just have botted with a new character named Ork or something, and we would not know who to keep our eyes on!


*snickers*
That's true.

Author:  Greneth [ 24 Nov 2017 04:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Its not like you're going to be looking for a blue-eyed blonde-haired person in Hitlers dream world. You just look for the one person running around nonstop, not answering anything, stealing kills... :P

Author:  Draugor [ 24 Nov 2017 06:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Cherek wrote:
Amberlee: Then he would just have botted with a new character named Ork or something, and we would not know who to keep our eyes on!



Thats what sitebans are for : ]

Author:  Makfly [ 24 Nov 2017 07:38 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Cherek wrote:
Amberlee: Then he would just have botted with a new character named Ork or something, and we would not know who to keep our eyes on!

I can only presume you're actually making fun, because that just seems to me like the most odd reason to not dole out a suitable punishment.

Author:  mallor [ 24 Nov 2017 08:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: Bottchecks

Draugor wrote:
Cherek wrote:
Amberlee: Then he would just have botted with a new character named Ork or something, and we would not know who to keep our eyes on!



Thats what sitebans are for : ]


That's what proxies are for!

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