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Bounce mechanic change. 
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Rising Hero

Joined: 27 Jun 2011 13:20
Posts: 371
Carnak wrote:
3. You move west, he follows, he moves west, you follow, both can execute.


This is not according to what Arman initially wrote. When he moves west in this case his specials abort and he becomes hunted, if I follow and manage to load up specials before he moves, mine are still preparing. Chasing someone usually means hunter and hunted roles change chaotically, unless we ever have a coded auto-hunting abilities, at least to some extent.


24 Jan 2018 08:03
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Wizard

Joined: 13 Sep 2013 16:58
Posts: 22
mallor wrote:
Carnak wrote:
3. You move west, he follows, he moves west, you follow, both can execute.


This is not according to what Arman initially wrote. When he moves west in this case his specials abort and he becomes hunted, if I follow and manage to load up specials before he moves, mine are still preparing. Chasing someone usually means hunter and hunted roles change chaotically, unless we ever have a coded auto-hunting abilities, at least to some extent.


arman wrote:
A simple summary of the change is that if you leave a room with someone
fighting you your special will abort. Specials won't be affected when chasing a
foe, so should not impact hunting practices.


As you can see, Armans note was but a summary of the basic functionality. Stating that specials wont be affected when chasing a foe, and should not impact hunting practices.

What the special does is it checks if you've moved while in combat, and checks when you try to execute your ability if your target is being hunted. Due to the complexities of player combat we didn't want to restrict it to only hunting, as any moment you can move too far and become hunted. So as long as the ability target is being hunted by you. Your special should not be hindered by movement.
This means that my stated scenario 3.
- You move west, he follows, he moves west, you follow, both can execute.
If both players are preparing special attacks during this interval, then both should succeed.

But dont take my word for it, test it ;) if you find any issues or bugs, please contact me and Ill look at it.

This is why I have yet to add the instant abort of the ability if you leave combat, as it would impact player hunting. Im currently trying to find a good way to handle it to reduce the "abort sequence" without impacting player fights.


24 Jan 2018 08:28
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Rising Hero

Joined: 27 Jun 2011 13:20
Posts: 371
Ok, I'm dumb, the bounce check is executed when specials should land, not when you actually move :) I hope the way it's implemented, it checks the first movement and "remembers" who is actually hunted. I'll find someone to test with.


24 Jan 2018 08:48
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Wizard

Joined: 13 Sep 2013 16:58
Posts: 22
mallor wrote:
Ok, I'm dumb, the bounce check is executed when specials should land, not when you actually move :) So I suppose if both players are in the same room, both specials will land no matter the movement in between?


Yes, as long as you meet the criteria of having hunted your target at any point during the prep interval, it doesn't matter how much you move. You can run around in circles and jump hedges along with your target being hunted and hunt in any number of ways.
So as I said:
1. A & B activate their specials, A runs west, B follows = A looses his special, B retains his special.
2. A & B activate their specials, A runs west, A returns = A looses his special, B retains his special.
3. A & B activate their specials, they run a cat and mouse game, A goes west, B goes 2 west, A goes west, B goes east, A goes east, and the running continues until they get to the same room just before their specials are about to hit = MAGIC! Both A & B's special attacks hit eachother!

Hopefully that will be good enough for player fights. We will just have to wait and see, and slowly improve it with the patience of the player community. And hopefully with helpful feedback that allow us to discern previous scenarios that have yet to be considered.


24 Jan 2018 08:59
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Adventurer

Joined: 23 Nov 2017 03:45
Posts: 91
Carnak wrote:
Yes, I imagine fighting a caster as a warrior at GA would be difficult, but atleast youll win out against thieves. That is sort of the order of things, Mage > Warrior > Thief > Mage.. or atleast the hopeful end result.

If you become a thief, youll soon enough be able to take out casters, but youll find difficulty with warriors, so the tradeoff may not be worth it for you? Or you bring a thief and youll have a blast against mages. :)


Er... what thieves?

Hiddukkel plauyers I met two that I am aware off, one was Myth+, and the other was a griefer (he steals and logs off right after).

Secret Society players I met are in it just for the shits and giggles, because they suck, they are utterly useless in combat.

Tricksters, same thing, I've heard they don't even have a special anymore.

so... maybe rogue-ish guilds count?

Rangers... I did had a serious PvP with a ranger same level as me. All it happened is that ranger kept healing itself, making the room dark, and so on, fight just kept going and going and going forever, I didn't owned said ranger.

Archers? seemly they are more figher than thief, and suck a bit too.



So what guild of those can defeat mages?


24 Jan 2018 15:58
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Apprentice

Joined: 30 Jun 2017 11:27
Posts: 40
Other magic guild?
Prepared fighter?


24 Jan 2018 18:49
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Adventurer

Joined: 30 Aug 2017 19:55
Posts: 92
Carnak wrote:

Greneth wrote:
(Dont forget this change absolutely screws any dodge abilities and will most likely ignore any constant magic abilities +1 for Magic users with shield spells)

1. Have you tested it with these abilities, if so can you state any specifics? If not, please test it and return if you find any issues.



The post boils down to not having the bounce implementation in PvP, to limit it to NPC-only. This is a doable change, codewise. If this is what people want, discuss it and find a reasonable argument as to why, to sway the stubborn wizards :P


No it was mostly just speculation on my part and I was wrong there, I figured since things like Evade and Tfocus were not passive skills and instead active skills that if you didn't wait long enough in the room it would cancel the dodge before it fired. But it seems that both are instantaneous.

Its not a horrible change the more I tinker with it, most of it doesn't change anything for me because I thought the old school bounce was solved years ago when Mercs were doing it. Think more than one bird could of been killed though when it comes to the way we view NPCs with a different approach on this though. Still not sure how I feel about the aggressor getting a bigger advantage in PvP when most of the time its not two even Myths going at it but one person getting gang raped by someone 4 times their level. But it is what it is.


26 Jan 2018 00:35
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Wizard

Joined: 13 Sep 2013 16:58
Posts: 22
Greneth wrote:
Still not sure how I feel about the aggressor getting a bigger advantage in PvP when most of the time its not two even Myths going at it but one person getting gang raped by someone 4 times their level. But it is what it is.


*chuckle*

If you're being "cordially invited" to "extracurricular activities" as you so eloquently state, I doubt it would make much of a difference if you manage to deal any damage to them at all. You probably just want to escape from the.. uncomfortable.. predicament, which you've somehow gotten yourself into.


26 Jan 2018 02:48
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