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PvP Arena Progress 
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Cherek wrote:
Gorboth: Do you plan on scaling the size of the arena based on how many are participating?

If its a static 800 room area, it sounds huge? Anyone who has ever tried to PVP on the Krynn war areas (or just conquer the NPCs for that matter) has probably noticed how it's much more about running around huge plains that look the same, trying to find something/someone to kill, than it's about actual fighting. Personally, I have always felt the most fun PVP moments in Genesis has taken place in rather small areas. Like when I was a knight and someone raided the Spur or Keep and all the fighting took place in the rather small Vingaard Keep area + plains. Another example would be Flotsam/Balifor that I also remember as fun places to fight. (It was a pretty small area before the Centaurs area and Kendermore were added).

And realistically we're probably looking at 1vs1 and 2vs2 battles, and any teams larger than that fighting each other will probably be pretty rare with our current playerbase? (Which is supposed to grow of course, but... well currently its not that big. Yet).

So yeah, whether it's gonna be fun or not, I think finding the correct size of the area will be very important.

Having that said, I love everything about the idea!


Right. Scale is important. What's funny is that when you operate on a grid, the number of rooms actually seems a lot less than if it was long roads with 800 rooms all going one direction. It ends up feeling more like square feet in a house. 2800 square feet in a house is a lot different than 2800 square feet in a straght line. Another huge thing here is that this will work with the magic map. In addition, you will be able to use castle walls and watchtowers to see where *other* people are on a magic-map style presentation. So, you can see positions on the field of battle other than your own, and because of the delay in travel, try to intercept, of use forms of communication to give orders from positions of visibility.

Here's what the map looks like right now. Each ascii character is a room.

@ = forest
" = plains
~ = river
` = shoreline
% = swamp
H = road
# = keep gate
_ = keep wall
| = keep wall
T = watchtower

Code:
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " | | | | | | | " " " " " " " % % % % % % % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " | | | | | | | " " " " " " " % % % % % % % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " | | | | | | | " " " " " " " % % % % % % % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " | _ _ # _ _ | " " " " " " " " % % % % % % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " % % % % % % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " % % % % % ~ ~
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " " % % % ~ ~ %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " " % % % ~ % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " " " % % ~ % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " " " ` ~ ~ % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " T " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " T " " ` ` ~ % % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " ` ` ~ ~ ` % %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " ` ` ` ~ ~ ` ` " %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " ` ` ` ` ` ~ ~ ~ ` ` ` " %
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " ` ` ` ` ` H ` ` ` ` ` ` ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ` ` ` ` " " "
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ~ ~ ~ ~ H ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ` ` ` ` ` ` " " " " "
 @ @ @ @ @ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ` ` ` H ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` " " " " " " " " "
 ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ @ @ ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` " H " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " "
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " "
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " "
 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ " " " " " " " " " " " " H " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " "


G.

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27 May 2014 19:53
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Gorboth: Heh. Interesting. 800 sounds like a HUGE place, but when you see it on t he map it doesn't seem that big. The idea of being able to see others on the map of course makes it much smaller no matter the size of the arena. I like that a lot. Even a small place can feel big if you have no idea where the other players are, if you do, its another thing.

Thats what makes the very underrated and sadly way too little used Fireball in Calia so fun - that its very strategic thanks to the live updated map of the arena. You can look at the map all the time and see where the ball is, and the other players, and intercept both ball and players. And the other way around if you have the ball, then you try to make passes and shots that cant be intercepted based on what you see on the map. And the moves also have delay, otherwise it simply would not work. (Just like you already planned). Maybe you even used Fireball as a reference already?

The Fireball arena is not many rooms though, maybe 20ish? And even with the live-map, move delay, and 8(!) players (4 real and 4 NPCs) it doesn't feel that crowded.

But I suppose the scale might be one of those things you'll simply have to try before you know whats right?

Anyway, exciting stuff. I think Genesis badly needs something like this!


28 May 2014 01:27
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Wizard
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Awesome stuff G.

If I may suggest some further reading for inspiration though (since I think that they did excellent job with this in LotRO and I don't see the point in re-inventing the wheel):
http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Monster_Play
http://www.theblackappendage.com/monstermanual

Image

I believe that we could implement some of the functionality from that, taking keeps and fighting for control over areas in LotRO was a blast.

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28 May 2014 13:38
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gorboth wrote:
  • Whichever guild or alliance of guilds controls the keep gets a bonus to gameplay throughout Genesis (tbd) for all members so long as the Keep remains in their control.
  • Each new Armaggeddon, Npcs control the Keep, and must be conquered.
  • To conquer the Keep from the npcs, players will need to gather resources from the various terrain types (woods, swampland, etc) to create seige equipment, and then put it to use.
  • Once conquered, the Keep will need to be defended against both players and npcs (who want it back). When the Keep is controlled by players, enemy players can team up with the npcs to win it back.
  • Player Death in the arena will result in teleportation from the arena with a time delay before they can return. There will be no loss of gear or exp.


Didn't World of Warcraft have a problem with this on servers that were heavy Alliance or Horde? The other faction basically got screwed because it was too hard to establish control for any period of time.

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29 May 2014 02:47
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I do expect that unless players care to defend their conquest, it won't last long. Because our playerbase isn't large, a big part of the picture will include npcs that protect the Keep, and serve whoever controls it, be it player or otherwise. So, if you conquer the Keep, you can set up npcs to assist in its defence, even if you aren't around.

G.

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29 May 2014 07:55
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castaneda wrote:
Quote:
Regarding gear, the idea will be similar to WoW or FPS pvp, where you have the gear you have, you bring it to the party, and you keep it even if you die


What happens if your weapon breaks in the PvP arena?
Will it be recovered when you spawn?


No, gear will function as it does in the rest of the game.

G.

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29 May 2014 19:09
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The way I play, there is no such thing as OOC anywhere in Genesis. I leave each player up to their own choice on such matters, of course, as this is simply my *own* manner of enjoying the game and bringing what I consider to be quality interaction and immersion to the table.

That being said, the idea is that if you win the Keep, your guild gets some sort of advantage that will extend throughout Genesis. So ... winning the Keep could affect much more than just the Arena, and is an incentive for doing so outside of simply having fun in the arena. At least, this is the current plan.

So ... OOC or not, if you help an enemy guild win the Keep, you'll be giving that enemy guild a global advantage.

G.

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29 May 2014 22:45
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Only occupational guilds can occupy it? What about layman?


29 May 2014 23:01
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If someone with only a layman guild can win the Keep, they will get the bonus for their guild. Good luck to them! ;-)

G.

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30 May 2014 07:58
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Joined: 14 Jun 2011 16:01
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Is the arena still in progress?


12 Mar 2015 16:36
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