Fact-checking and critical thinking

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Cherek
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Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Cherek » 02 Jul 2020 14:05

Hello!

Since I took over as Keeper I haven't really used this forum section, mainly because I had not really figured out what to use it for, but now I know. I am going to use this forum section kind of like a "Keeper's blog", and share my random thoughts about different Genesis-related stuff.

For my first post I am going to write about something that is both worrying for the game and quite exhausting for us admins - the Genesis rumour mill.

I personally feel that a big problem with social media today is that a lot of people using it simply do not check the facts of things they share. A lot of people see something they like, or something that upsets them, and immediately shares the article to their friends, who does the same, etc. Sadly, many does not bother to check who wrote the article, or stop and think if it sounds reasonable at all.

So, what does this has to do with Genesis? Well, the exact same thing is going on in our community, and it's really bad for the players and wizards who suffer from the constant spreading of false information on Discord, forums, in-game and in private conversations.

Lately I have spent a lot of time talking to upset players who are certain the Genesis administration and some of our wizards are deeply corrupt. If all rumours are to be believed we:

- Clearly support the good-aligned players of Genesis.
- Clearly support the evil-aligned players of Genesis.
- Clearly support guild X.
- Clearly support guild Y.
- Do everything we can do destroy guild Z.
- Allow players that we like to cheat, while punishing other players we don't like.
- Help specific players to cheat by giving them items and/or nerfing their enemies.
- Spread secret information to select players in order to give them an advantange over others.
- Have some sort of agenda where we want a select group of players/guilds to benefit, while making the game miserable for the other side.

Some players have even quit the game because they know the admin is so corrupt and cheaty the game is not worth playing anymore.

People, you need to STOP and THINK.

Ask yourselves, WHY would we do all the things above? Why would we destroy a specific guild, or help a specific player? Why would we treat people differently on purpose? What's in it for us? What do we have to gain from doing that? Do you really think we spend countless of hours of our free time to run this game, only to then hurt the game by cheating or helping select players to cheat? Why would we risk that?

I am urging you all NOT to automatically believe everything you hear. Instead, stop and think. Is what you heard reasonable? Is it logical? Can whoever said it provide any sort of proof? Can you check things yourself, and perhaps find some proof?

Here's en example that happened some time ago:

A player loses their imbued weapon, and soon after is seen with the same weapon with the same imbument. What's the most logical explanation?
A: Wizard X cloned them a new weapon.
B: Being a known EQ-hoarder who plays many hours daily, they had a spare weapon in their rack, and went to Sparkle to imbue it using their big collection of imbuement stones.

Unfortunately a surprisingly large number of people apparently believe it's A, even if B makes way more sense and they have absolutely no proof that it was option A. Still, they tell their friend they're sure a corrupt wizard did it. The friend in turn gets upset, and tells their friends, and within hours a large portion of the Genesis population now "knows" that wizard X is a corrupt cheater, and probably the admin too, since they clearly let this happen.

When people have confronted me with their "truths" lately, I have in many of cases (including the one above), been able to completely dismiss it by providing proof that what they thought was going on was completely false. Unfortunately, rumours continue to persist, and it's very hard and time-consuming for us to win over the rumours, even when we have proof that's it completely false.

Now, I think the majority of the rumours floating around come from assumptions, like in the above example. However, just like in real life some players might also start these kind of rumours on purpose in order to get what they want, or use false rumours to hurt a player, wizard, guild, or faction they dislike. This is very common on social media as well, where people with extreme opinions spread false articles and false rumours, relying on people to become emotional and upset and share it without checking the source - which a lot of people unfortunately do.

Now, I wrote this from my personal perspective as a wizard and admin member, but this isn't something that only happens to us wizards, rumours are of course spread about players too, and I urge you to use the same strategy there. Stop and think if the rumour makes sense, and check the facts / ask for proof before you share it with others.

Thank you for reading all the way here!

Kvator
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Kvator » 02 Jul 2020 14:36

Cherek wrote:
02 Jul 2020 14:05
Ask yourselves, WHY would we do all the things above?
Because there're many of you and you are pretty inconsistent :)

Some wizards when code stuff want to focus on some fun features / mechanics / lore.
Other want to just bend the rules as much as possible (within some boundaries I guess) to put in place most OP guilds/items/areas possible.

Short example from my experience:

Genesis Wizard - "No Kvator we can't boost kenders anymore because they're not fighters and rogue guilds CAID is limited"

also Genesis Wizard - create Fire Knives guild

because of that i can tick points:

- Clearly support the evil-aligned players of Genesis.
- Clearly support guild X
- Do everything we can do destroy guild Z
- Have some sort of agenda where we want a select group of players/guilds to benefit, while making the game miserable for the other side.

with full confidence :)

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Cherek
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Cherek » 02 Jul 2020 15:16

Kvator: My post is about spreading rumours without critical thinking and fact-checking first. If you do have the facts, come talk to me and bring your facts and we'll discuss it. I never said all wizards always do everything right, but what you wrote pretty much proves my point. I can think of several different explanations to your concern, but you immediately jumped to the conclusion that wizards must be anti-kender biased, and that is the only reasonably explanation.

Just for fun, can you think of any _other_ possibilities?

Rache
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Rache » 02 Jul 2020 15:32

Cherek wrote:
02 Jul 2020 14:05
Now, I wrote this from my personal perspective as a wizard and admin member, but this isn't something that only happens to us wizards, rumours are of course spread about players too, and I urge you to use the same strategy there. Stop and think if the rumour makes sense, and check the facts / ask for proof before you share it with others.
Absolutely agree 100%. Thank you, Cherek.

Celemir
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Celemir » 02 Jul 2020 15:56

Cherek wrote:
02 Jul 2020 15:16
Kvator: My post is about spreading rumours without critical thinking and fact-checking first. If you do have the facts, come talk to me and bring your facts and we'll discuss it. I never said all wizards always do everything right, but what you wrote pretty much proves my point. I can think of several different explanations to your concern, but you immediately jumped to the conclusion that wizards must be anti-kender biased, and that is the only reasonably explanation.

Just for fun, can you think of any _other_ possibilities?
I think I will bite on this kender thing, even if do not know anything about the fire knives, hidden agendas and stuff like that.
I agree that it is perception and assumptions but that does not mean it is not true on some level.
If the kenders were strong I am quite sure it would be a very active guild but alas it is not.
The thing is the kender specials work against the guild arc type, where (this is purely speculation on my side,) the fire knives work with it. And can probably work with backstab mm.
You give a none tank guild a tanking mode that is not supported by the guild type, Or at least that is how it feels. It has gotten better,- but a tank works better with strong defensive skills and shields, not just combat aid.
It just means kenders get pummeled slower.
We have 2 rogue guilds, one strong and one weak. Even if it is more of a guild theme that does not work well with "realities" and not a wizard bias. It surely can look like it is so in many eyes.

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Cherek
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Cherek » 02 Jul 2020 16:22

Celemir: I think a discussion about the strenghts and weaknesess of the kender guild is a large topic, perhaps not suitable for this thread. I would suggest making a new thread if you want to discuss that in more detail.

But, to get back to topic of rumours and fact-checking. Let's for the sake of argument assume you and Kvator are correct, the kender guild IS weaker than Fire knives (and most other guilds). Is that automatic proof wizards are biased in favor of evils? Or set to destroy the kender guild?

This is one example, but this happens ALL the time. Each time one guild appears stronger than another guild, or when one guild is nerfed or boosted, some people will most likely claim wizard bias and start spreading rumours.

Here are some ideas from the top of my head to why kenders are too weak (if we assume they are):

- You are actually wrong and the guild is well-balanced, you simply don't know enough details to understand why.
- You are correct, we made a mistake here, but we have no wizard willing to work on the problem right now.
- You are correct, we made a mistake, but we have no interested wizard with enough programming knowledge to fix it.
- You are correct, we made a mistake, but it's one of many issues and it's simply not a piority right now, sorry.
- You are correct, but the guildmaster of the kender guild wants it to be weaker than the Fire knives, because they want to attract roleplayers not powerplayers to the guild.
- You are correct, the Fire Knives are way too powerful and somehow we missed that, which wasn't on purpose. But thanks to your proofs and facts, that you brought to us in a nice and respectful way (without accusations), we can now fix it.
- We're a bunch of amateurs who try to create a game with very limited resources and manpower, and we messed up, but we don't even know it because we're kind of incompetent.
- We're corrupt and anti-kender biased, we want them to fail and nobody to join the guild.

If you were to rank these possible explanations from most to least likely, how would you rank them?

Kvator
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Kvator » 02 Jul 2020 16:50

Cherek wrote:
02 Jul 2020 15:16
If you do have the facts, come talk to me and bring your facts and we'll discuss it.
I gave two facts (quote I heard from a wizard + guild created by a wizard) -> and then wrote what points from your 'conspiracy list' could one easily make after connecting the dots here.
Cherek wrote:
02 Jul 2020 15:16
but you immediately jumped to the conclusion that wizards must be anti-kender biased, and that is the only reasonably explanation.
You seems biased actually (player criticising something = rumour spreader that can't even check his facts or something). I actually gave my conclusion at very beginning:

Wizards are inconsistent and just as in player community we have RPers and Powerplayers it seems there are kind of RP-Wizards (Gorboth's guilds, most of Arman's guilds*) and kind of Power-wizards (Calia, Faerun),

* created or reworked by him
Cherek wrote:
02 Jul 2020 16:22
If you were to rank these possible explanations from most to least likely, how would you rank them?
If we're looking at the results then it's definately the last one:
- We're corrupt and anti-kender biased, we want them to fail and nobody to join the guild. xDDDD

Mirandus
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Mirandus » 02 Jul 2020 16:57

As the person who worked on revamping the Secret Society, I can assure you it was not done in a way to hinder or hurt the guild and was done, in fact, by wizards who care a great deal about it.

One thing I know I've never received, though someone else may have, is a mail in-game outlining some of the issues folks see with the guild and how they feel it might be improved.

What began as a sincere plea for folks to think critically has devolved, again, into conspiracy theorizing. Rather than making conclusions based on what you "know" why not try to find out more. Did you know I worked on recoding the Kenders? Did you know it's my favourite guild in all of Genesis? Did you know I wanted to make them a viable guild that people would enjoy playing?

Rather than deciding you are right and everyone else is wrong, why not consider alternatives and ask questions.

Kvator
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Kvator » 02 Jul 2020 17:11

Mirandus wrote:
02 Jul 2020 16:57
Did you know I worked on recoding the Kenders?
Did i wrote 'Mirandus didnt work on recoding the Kenders'? And hey afaik it was not officially communicated about u being involved (it was with 2 other wizards).
Mirandus wrote:
02 Jul 2020 16:57
Did you know it's my favourite guild in all of Genesis?.
No. I don't know what's your favourite colour either.
Mirandus wrote:
02 Jul 2020 16:57
Did you know I wanted to make them a viable guild that people would enjoy playing?
Good job!

Celemir
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Re: Fact-checking and critical thinking

Post by Celemir » 02 Jul 2020 17:16

Cherek wrote:
02 Jul 2020 16:22
Celemir: I think a discussion about the strenghts and weaknesess of the kender guild is a large topic, perhaps not suitable for this thread. I would suggest making a new thread if you want to discuss that in more detail.

But, to get back to topic of rumours and fact-checking. Let's for the sake of argument assume you and Kvator are correct, the kender guild IS weaker than Fire knives (and most other guilds). Is that automatic proof wizards are biased in favor of evils? Or set to destroy the kender guild?

This is one example, but this happens ALL the time. Each time one guild appears stronger than another guild, or when one guild is nerfed or boosted, some people will most likely claim wizard bias and start spreading rumours.

Here are some ideas from the top of my head to why kenders are too weak (if we assume they are):

- You are actually wrong and the guild is well-balanced, you simply don't know enough details to understand why.
- You are correct, we made a mistake here, but we have no wizard willing to work on the problem right now.
- You are correct, we made a mistake, but we have no interested wizard with enough programming knowledge to fix it.
- You are correct, we made a mistake, but it's one of many issues and it's simply not a piority right now, sorry.
- You are correct, but the guildmaster of the kender guild wants it to be weaker than the Fire knives, because they want to attract roleplayers not powerplayers to the guild.
- You are correct, the Fire Knives are way too powerful and somehow we missed that, which wasn't on purpose. But thanks to your proofs and facts, that you brought to us in a nice and respectful way (without accusations), we can now fix it.
- We're a bunch of amateurs who try to create a game with very limited resources and manpower, and we messed up, but we don't even know it because we're kind of incompetent.
- We're corrupt and anti-kender biased, we want them to fail and nobody to join the guild.

If you were to rank these possible explanations from most to least likely, how would you rank them?
I think you misunderstood me. I completely agree with your´e premise. I don't think wizards have ill intent or are biased.
I was merely trying to express why it could be pressived as such, and why.
As I said, I know nothing about Fire knives,- if they are more powerful or anything but that is the feel you get when reading the forums, and some people could properly explain if this is true from experience or not.
I will not rank your list as it would be putting words in my mouth that are not mine, and words I do not agree with. Lists like this are a fallacy in my opinion.
I do not think you are amatures or are anti-kender. My experience is just with kenders and that is why I wrote about them, This could have been any guild that has problemers, just like the Monks, but for different reasons. I am more than willing to admit that I am wrong if you would be so kind to explain why it is so, and we could argue why we would disagree with that or not. But as you said that would be a completely different topic.

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