Guilds of Genesis

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Berwyn
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Posts: 203
Joined: 02 Sep 2012 23:56
Location: Misty Mountains

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Berwyn » 15 Mar 2018 10:48

Draugor wrote:
Kvator wrote:Just had to post it somewhere.

Embrace the power of recoded kenders! :D


The dangerous squat orc is at death's door.
>
The dangerous squat orc seems to be regaining his self control.
You flip away from the dangerous squat orc's attack.
You let the stone fly from your hoopak towards the dangerous squat orc's left arm, landing with a sharp crack.
You are physically feeling well and mentally in full vigour.
The dangerous squat orc is barely alive.

Size - myth
Weapon - carved quickwood hoopak (best possible)
F****** nice! Kenders got a healing spell now? :D
Torturing poor snaga, eh?
"Tis but a scratch" - Black Knight, Monty Python and the Holy Grail

Zugzug
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Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Zugzug » 15 Mar 2018 11:24

On a serious note, I am glad that Arman started this conversation. I can't attest to many sides, specifically not those I interact with or team with regularly - having just a single character in Genesis. I do wish that the wizards take a look at existing guilds and perhaps improve those, instead of creating more and more content that separates existing players into more and more niches.

Specifically, I am talking about complete lack of versatility available to the "evil" side fighters in Gen - all three fighter guilds are stuck with zero weapons choice (well, ONE out of three guilds can chose either sword+shield or a two-handed sword, but that's *it*), no possibility of tank rotation in battles (I place the lack of "evil" newbies - alts not included - mostly on this, as it becomes quite hard to help them, if we can't keep them alive), lack of truly interesting (and powerful) layman choices (when a layman guild states in rules that you will be expelled for associating with a portion of your faction - undeads and necromancers - it cannot be considered as a neutral option).

As it stands right now, "goodie" side has exclusives on:
1) choosing your weapon in a battle (sword primary, polearm or club secondary I believe in KoS, either sword or polearm primary as calians)
2) all possible forms of tank rotator (rescue, move behind, spell to make teammates move behind you (EC)
3) having specialist guilds (true "tanking", true DPS) and as of late an ultra-able healing layman - which, together with tank rotation in battle allows access to areas at very early levels that are closed to evil side until "mega myth" sizes - in other words, more choices and more fun earlier in your "career")

Also, nothing really against creating faction-unique content, but how about something cool and unique for an evil fighter? Cause it's getting awfully lonely out here, to be honest (and no, this isn't a joke)

Kvator
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Posts: 561
Joined: 02 Sep 2010 21:25

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Kvator » 15 Mar 2018 11:57

Isn't the fact that goodie guilds are more 'team oriented' while evil guilds are better for solo-play (or in small teams) sounds reasonable?

As for the layman options - isn't it just EW that breaks the balance? Best 'fighter' options are either neutral (BM) or evil (AA - this one's balanced somehow with the fact that only mercs can use its full potential of it).

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Arman
Wizard
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Joined: 22 Sep 2014 13:15

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Arman » 15 Mar 2018 14:29

Zugzug wrote:On a serious note, I am glad that Arman started this conversation. I can't attest to many sides, specifically not those I interact with or team with regularly - having just a single character in Genesis. I do wish that the wizards take a look at existing guilds and perhaps improve those, instead of creating more and more content that separates existing players into more and more niches.

Specifically, I am talking about complete lack of versatility available to the "evil" side fighters in Gen - all three fighter guilds are stuck with zero weapons choice (well, ONE out of three guilds can chose either sword+shield or a two-handed sword, but that's *it*), no possibility of tank rotation in battles (I place the lack of "evil" newbies - alts not included - mostly on this, as it becomes quite hard to help them, if we can't keep them alive), lack of truly interesting (and powerful) layman choices (when a layman guild states in rules that you will be expelled for associating with a portion of your faction - undeads and necromancers - it cannot be considered as a neutral option).

As it stands right now, "goodie" side has exclusives on:
1) choosing your weapon in a battle (sword primary, polearm or club secondary I believe in KoS, either sword or polearm primary as calians)
2) all possible forms of tank rotator (rescue, move behind, spell to make teammates move behind you (EC)
3) having specialist guilds (true "tanking", true DPS) and as of late an ultra-able healing layman - which, together with tank rotation in battle allows access to areas at very early levels that are closed to evil side until "mega myth" sizes - in other words, more choices and more fun earlier in your "career")

Also, nothing really against creating faction-unique content, but how about something cool and unique for an evil fighter? Cause it's getting awfully lonely out here, to be honest (and no, this isn't a joke)
Thanks Zugzug. I do want to flag that we are focused on getting existing guilds up to scratch. There are a lot that need work and modernisation... but you can't make a wizard work on a guild they aren't interested in fixing up. And sometimes guild codes move at a glacial pace. Recoding a guild is torturous work. It isn't fun. In most cases it is easier to close old guilds and code something else... it certainly would have been for the Priests of Takhisis!

Right now work is being done on recoding the Dragon Order and Elven Archers, as well as a replacement for the necromancer layman guild. As far as recodes go, the PoT, kender, and SCoP have all been recently recoded. Global backstab has been recoded. But there are plenty of others that badly need a recode... Heralds, rangers, shieldbearers, minstrels to name a few.

New guilds aren't going to be a code focus from an occupational point of view (with the exception of the WoHS and necromancers), with any focus on new guilds being in the layman sphere. We have some currently in development (such as Carnak's beastmasters), and a few others that are in the conceptual stage that would tick the boxes you are wanting to see created.

On the new healing layman guild - on balance Krynn needed a good aligned layman guild. When you look at the mix of what Krynn offers in the layman space, it basically leans towards the evil side (thieves, templars, pirates) or neutral side (minotaurs), with some niche good options in the Elven archers or shieldbearers. Mindful this was coded before I became AoD, my bailiwick was the Dragonlance domains... so I don't make any apologies for focusing on my back yard back then :)

Having said that, layman healing for evils is something that is being planned by other domains. So stay tuned.

Now as for your points. First two I'd agree with. The second point is currently being worked on with a solution to come very very soon. First point - while I agree, I'd probably like to see a thoughtful solution to it rather than simply giving DAs/AA an extra weapon type. AAs will always be club and shield... that is the core of what the are, and I don't think I'd ever allow that to change. DAs I could possibly allow to select their weapon type... mindful that the weapon type would only be effective for those with a matching damage type (impale or slash weapons). But to be honest it isn't a high priority for changing (I am sure Dragon Order and rangers would be telling you to get back in line!). But you never know...

Third point I wouldn't agree with. Evil definitely has specialist advantage over good. They have the best occupational burst spell damage by FAR. Ridiculously by far. They also have the best occupational healers in the game. DAs have the highest DPS out of all the guilds that do not rely on a team member. Specialisation definitely isn't exclusive to the 'goodies'.

Anyway, keep up the discussion. We are particularly interested in gaps in layman options. My original post doesn't take into account racial or occupational guild restrictions, so I'd love to hear your thoughts on the limitations of your occupational guilds as far as what options you have in the layman space.

Kvator
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Joined: 02 Sep 2010 21:25

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Kvator » 15 Mar 2018 15:25

Pirates are neutral btw :)

It's just kniggets being restrictive in their nature!

Johnny
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Location: Washington State

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Johnny » 15 Mar 2018 18:14

Arman wrote: (...rangers would be telling you to get back in line!)
Oi! Get back in line everyone! Your guilds actually function properly!



As for layman options, Riders of the Mark could be an interesting layman options that focuses on the relationship between a rider and it's horse? As your title grows so does your horse and the abilities it can do. This would be a goodie option... maybe add a Gundaband Warg riding evil version?

Alchemist layman option! There is a lot options for a lay guild like this? Can also break it up into goodie/neutral/and evil. Brews like the witch's from the GK that explode or freeze opponents, increased health/mana regeneration, invisibility, ability to see invisible, poisons, haste, stone skin, turn an enemy into a frog, temporary sex/race changes, whatever!

Beastmasters! Woohoo Carnak!

My idea bank ran dry.
Last edited by Johnny on 16 Mar 2018 17:43, edited 1 time in total.

Saimon
Wanderer
Posts: 57
Joined: 26 Jul 2017 23:08

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Saimon » 15 Mar 2018 23:55

Are Amazons for all races or only for human females?

Drazson
Expert
Posts: 285
Joined: 24 Jan 2016 21:27

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Drazson » 16 Mar 2018 05:56

Johnny wrote:Alchemist layman option!
Wow, a "I always wanted this, just didn't know it yet" one.

hoso
Greenhorne
Posts: 7
Joined: 20 May 2017 05:53

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by hoso » 17 Jul 2018 08:13

Will Tricksters get a recode o: ???

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Dhez
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Joined: 07 Oct 2015 17:38
Location: Gorlovka

Re: Guilds of Genesis

Post by Dhez » 17 Jul 2018 09:03

I'd love a fishing and cooking craft. Food with buffs.
You see a mousetrap. I see free cheese and a challenge.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

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