Where did the promotion campaign go?

Discuss ideas about promoting Genesis and inviting more players into the Genesis community
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Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Cherek » 10 Oct 2010 14:18

Well, we've been hearing about this elusive campaign for years now. As our player numbers continue to drop, I still wonder, where is it? We utterly need it. More than anything else.

Some background, how I remember it.

In the past, we didnt really need any promotion since word of mouth and the coolness of a multiplayer textgame was enough to bring in new players. More than the game could handle even. Thus the queue.

But eventually times changed and our playerbase began to decrease. And during all those years almost nothing was done to bring in new players. We had a "vote for Genesis" campaign, and a new webpage. Which was good! But considering the timeframe, and the result, not enough.

When Gorboth took over as keeper (3 years ago or something?!), he boldy stated we should double the population in a year. Everyone cheered and Gorboth was THE man. As you know we didnt double the population, the population remained almost the same in that year, with a slight decrease. Since then, I dont have statistics, but just being around makes me feel its still decreasing. Surely not increasing.

Now, we've had alot of things done to the game itself since Gorboth became a keeper. Maybe more changes than we ever have had before.

But I ask, to what use? What do we have to show for it? Is the game more fun now, with all the changed and new things? I do not think so. Was the game funnier before even without all this? I would have to say yes. And why? Because we had more players. Simple as that.

Am I questioning Gorboth's priorites? Yes I am. Am I saying he is not the right man to lead Genesis? I dont know. While I like Gorboth (who doesnt) truth is, when it comes down to it, there is alot of bold talk on how to make Genesis a popular game again, but very little to show for it. The keeper's honeymoon is over, the results are in, and its not looking good.

Some of the things that have been done.

- The guild recode.

- Opening of new guilds and bringing back old ones.

- The recode of Sparkle.

- Armageddon drops.

- The recode of Faerie.

- The newbie land

- The quest orbs.

- Imbuements.

And tons of smaller changes, but these are some of the "big" changes we have had since Gorboth took over as keeper. some turned out really well, some perhaps not. But that's not the thing, the thing is the size of the list compared to this list:

Promotional improvements we have seen.

Deleted player's pardon
I think it was successful? Some did came back?

Then... nothing.

So I wonder, with a goal of doubling the population, one would think something more had been done? But truth is, thats all we have done.

I question the priorities of the admin. New players seem to be at the very bottom of the list to me. I do not know what has been done in the background, or what's in the works. But in all honesty, we have absolutely nothing to show for whatever effort has been put into this. So whatever it is, it has sadly not worked.

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Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Rhynox » 10 Oct 2010 19:14

Suppose you are a player on hiatus, and are invited back to the game. So you accept and, after trying some guilds, you choose one that you feel is the most powerful. Then the global balance hits your guild and balances it down (since indeed was too powerful). How would you feel?

So, I understand if they want to finish the balance first so that, whenever someone on hiatus joins, he won't have his guild balanced down in a few months making him wanting to leave again due injustice.


Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Laurel » 10 Oct 2010 22:58

Suppose you are stuck in a guild that's underpowered towards current standards and wizards can't give even an approximate time for recode ... that's where SS and Rangers are.

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Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Recoba » 10 Oct 2010 23:35

I remembered that Gorboth explained not too long ago that a big promotion campaign launched prematurely would be counterproductive, as it will show an "unfinished" game.

The idea is that Genesis needs to be reformed further according to a program in progress, and THEN the big promo campaign will hit.

Personally I think the game itself is developing fine design-wise, and given that it's being developed as always by unpaid volunteers who have other jobs and no guarantee of a bigger audience than the current one, I feel the progress has been quite impressive.

Based on the evidence I can see, I have to say that Gorboth is doing a great job.

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Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Cherek » 11 Oct 2010 00:01

Laurel: Please create an own topic if you wanna complain your rangers are underpowered. But yes, the rebalancing has made the guilds more imbalanced for now since the new guilds have been released with years inbetween...

Recoba: Yes, its a volunteer workforce. But we cant use that as an excuse all the time. And just because of that, perhaps one should not tackle too big, and too time consuming tasks at the time. The game will never be finished. At some point you gotta decide what really HAS to be fixed, and then move on that what really matters. Players.

I disagree with you about the admin doing a great job. One of Gorboth's main goals when he took charge was to increase the population. Yes, there has been some good changes to the game design, but the goal was to get more players. It has failed. I ask, how was it supposed to be reached? It's not like everything has been done to get new players. You try your hardest and its not enough, thats one thing. But from where I stand, there has not even been an attempt. You set a goal, and you miss by a mile, I think you have earned a kick in the butt. *kick Gorboth*

Personally I think the game was fine 10 years ago, it was fine 5 years ago, it is fine now. It is flawed and it will always be, but its still fun, or else we would not be here? I bet you my ingame bank account that 1,2,3 years from now there will still be unfinished parts. Still things to fix. Guilds to recode, webpage to fix, quest system to be reworked, etc etc. And right now we're also spending alot of time fixing things that are broken because we have too few players...

I am pretty tired of seeing 10 players online. The longer we wait, the harder it will be, because we will have less players to start with. Less people to help, smaller comunity, and a less motivated comunity.

We, the current players, have been given nothing to hope for in terms of new players in the last... decade? But tons of other things, thats nice, but not what we REALLY need. We need players... now.

Dont get me wrong, I understand the idea of showing a finished and polished game, I like alot of the changes, it nice. But we gotta decide what we really need, and fix that. Not hundreds of other things too. And it is Gorboth's job to motivate his wizards to focus on what we really need, volunteer or not. We cant wait another 3 years and hope the game is "complete" then. Most likely it wont be, history shows.

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Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by gorboth » 11 Oct 2010 04:34


Your disappointment and frustration are not unmerited, and who can accept the burden of responsibility if not me? On that score, I fully accept the impact of your foot on my fanny. It might even help!

As this latest note by you bears testimony, you are a person who takes the time to write thorough, thoughtful, and well-crafted posts that speak clearly what is on your mind without coddling either the subject or the intended readership. For this, who can but applaud you? Naturally, it is a bit unpleasant for me to read such a harsh and public critique of the situation. That being said, you've done us all the favor of sugar-coating nothing, and specifically raising questions that you feel not only need to be answered, but that perhaps represent a last desperate call to action.

I think a majority of the problem right now can be summed up thusly - I have been doing a very poor job of communication lately. When I first came on as Keeper, I'd say about 90% of my activity in Genesis was spent guiding thoughts and communicating priorities to the people who care about the game. Only about 10% of my activity was spent doing hands-on work where I was the actual worker-bee. This was three years ago. As time has worn on, that ratio has been upended. These days, I'd say about 90% of my time is spent doing "work" in Genesis (the bee-like variety) but only about 10% of my energy is spent on large-scale communication and mobilization of the energies that hold Genesis up.

The result of this is that regardless of how much work is getting done, the impressions that govern the attitudes of the larger playerbase are often a product of guess-work rather than informed opinion.

Does this mean that the picture is actually a lot brighter than the one you paint, Cherek? Well ... yes! There are definitely realities at work that we cannot simply gloss over, but there are also quite a lot of things that are happening that are not being discussed as often as they should be, and therefore are not on the forefront of the thinking of most players.

Here is a short-list:
  • The redesign of the website is truly exciting. A top-tier artist from the golden age of RPG's (the lead artist from the Ultima series) has been working for the last 4 months with Tapakah and I on a front-page that, frankly, is a dream come true.
  • Eowul has made some good progress on an interface for the "PLAY NOW" client that, if realized, will give us something very compelling and easy-to-use for beginners.
  • In conjunction with the imbuement system, a newbie-grinder dungeon replete with quests and high-quality content has been fully designed, partially coded, and brought fully to bear with the functionality of the magic map.
  • Cotillion has proposed a method by which we could create a type of "instancing" in the tutorial so that should the number of visitors suddenly skyrocket, we could handle the volume without a bottleneck.
Now ... I am only above mentioning things that directly deal to promotion as this was the primary concern of your post, Cherek. Numerous other projects and needs have continued to be addressed as we find the time and manpower (the most recent being the long-awaited fix of herb recovery.)

Are we in a rough patch? Well ... of course. The game has been in decline for a steady 15 years, and the way we will effectively combat that is hard-won. There is no "quick fix" I am convinced. Premature advertisement will be a devastating mistake that we would be very challenged to recover from. As such, we remain on the slow and steady path that I have envisioned as a way forward toward far greater things. Admittedly, my goals have not always been realistic (i.e. the "double the playerbase in one year's time!!!" type thing.) My methods, however, remain entirely so.

Mmmmmm ... pie ...


Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Laurel » 11 Oct 2010 07:05

Cherek wrote:Laurel: Please create an own topic if you wanna complain your rangers are underpowered. But yes, the rebalancing has made the guilds more imbalanced for now since the new guilds have been released with years inbetween...
1st sentence you go after me, eventho you agree with my statement in the next ... maturity is a virtue I guess

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Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Makfly » 11 Oct 2010 07:19

That was an uplifting read, Gorboth.
But, by your estimation, when will we see the promotional campaign start off?

Also, I guess this promotion will cost money?
If so, then it might be a good idea to open the gates to an internal donation drive, or just an open Genesis Paypal, so the funds can trickle in, in advance?
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Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Uther » 11 Oct 2010 07:26

If players only spend half their time online in the game instead of being on the forums posting the population would increase.

People are of course allowed to do whatever they want. And I applaud constructive posts.

The excuse, the volunteer workforce, are valid every day of the week. If you are not happy with their progress,
wiz yourself, oh wait aren't you a wiz allready? Btw you don't need to be a wizard to contribute to Genesis.

I assume there are players out there who have friends that used to play Genesis before they can try to convince
to comeback. But competing with the graphic MMORPG's (Many men online roleplaying girls :) ) is very hard.
We can not offer that. Creating Genesis in a MMORPG wont ever happen due to copyrights etc etc. But it would
have been a wonderfull sight, but it would kill Genesis the Mud.

Gorboth aimed high, he has gotten quite high up but not reached all the way, what did the other keepers do ?
What have you done yourself Cherek ? Have you contributed with something? Except the ideas you post on the

All in all, I think Gorboth has done one hell of a facelift for Genesis, along with his staff.
All comments are made by the player behind Uther, NOT THE CHARACTER UTHER!

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Re: Where did the promotion campaign go?

Post by Cherek » 11 Oct 2010 09:33

Laurel: Lets just drop it and go after eachother somewhere else? I did not mean to go after you, but it did sounded like you were about to turn my promotional questions into a "whining-about-my-underpowered-guild" thread which is something alot of people have a tendancy to do. If that was not the case I apologize.

Gorboth: Thank you very much for taking the time to answer. I simply based my note on information I had. Which is what I can see. Your note does give some hope, I do agree that some things need to be fixed. Webpage, play-now and a newbie grinding area being on top of my list as well. I hope you will settle at some point, and not too distant, and eventually decide to move forward with what we have! The game is, fundamentally fun, and even though I complained alot, I still play and enjoy this game, which is thanks to you wizards!

Makfly makes a good point too, perhaps there is background work (for instance money collecting), research, or other things, that can be started already. So we are ready for a campaign when time comes? As I mentioned before I am pretty sure there are some of us in the community who are willing to help with non-code things. Dont forget to ask.

Uther: Gorboth has done alot of good for the game and he gets alot of credit for it too, dont get me wrong. But since he did set a high goal, and missed, I do think we can afford to kick him in the butt for it. :)

You ask what I have done?

Well I do try to help out when I have time. Yes, at one time I did think "I'll wiz myself and fix it." And I did. Well, I contributed with some small area and some quest but mostly I learned I am a player. I want to play this game, not create it. Not everyone can be wizars, but we can still do alot for the game. It was a long time I go I stepped down from being a wizard to be able to play the game as a mortal instead. (Rules said you couldnt really do both at the time.) So I do what I can to be the best player I can be, to help the new people we have as much as I can (seconds or not), etc. That is something we can all do, no matter how little time we have. And something we really can be better at, all of us.

About posting on the forum. I do try to stay active here. You say we should spend the time playing the game instead? Well, true too, but I think an active forum is helpful. I have noticed when the forums we have had are bubbling with activity the playerbase also increases. (or maybe its the other way around?). But either way an active comunity helps I think.

Also I already tried to use some of my RL skills to help, by creating a map-template for the webpage. Its in the topic below this one. Tapakah seemed to like it very much so I hope we will use it to create maps for the new webpage. So we can all do that as well, I am sure many people have some useful skill that could be helpful in some way. Dont we have some people working in advertising for instance?!!

So thats what I do. Might not be much, but I hope its something.

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