Observation on brutality vs. quests

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Kaiya
Greenhorne
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Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Kaiya » 10 Oct 2015 07:01

Most of my hunting has been for quests. The only non-quest hunting I did was in the tutorial. Since arriving in Sparkle, the only hunting I have done has been a requirement to complete quests. Yet, I find that my brutality level is already at 'touchy' which I see is halfway through the brutality scale. This seems a bit unbalanced and a bit unfair. I think that if you are going to have a system where your quest experience balances out your non-quest killing experience gain, you shouldn't be punished with raising brutality by killing things when you -have- to kill to complete a quest.

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Cherek
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Cherek » 10 Oct 2015 14:10

You'll raise your brutality very quickly early on, but you will notice it levels off quite a bit once you reach the higher levels. There are basically no players below "brutal" unless they are recovering from deaths or are very new. This system was designed decades ago and it's existence has been up for debate around here a lot of times, it has both pros and cons, some players feel that it should be removed altogether, others think it works fine as it is.

I understand it must seem weird to raise brutality by doing quests though. Can't argue there. But even if the killing in the quest leads to a higher brutality short term, in the end it's always good to quest anyway. Because you will die a lot of times, and you can never lose your quest XP, and in the end it will have a positive effect on your brutality.

Draugor
Myth
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Draugor » 10 Oct 2015 23:34

Its cause brute sucks ass and should be removed :P
Or reformed majorly :P

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Ody
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Ody » 11 Oct 2015 00:10

I don't really mind brut. Of course I'm the sort who mostly socializes.
All I am is your Van Gogh; I paint our dreams on the golden coast
I stay up high, flying solo; Don't come too close
I just ghost
I told you I am the new Poe; I sold my soul to the radio
I steal your heart in the shadows; Don't come too close
I just ghost

Egwene
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Egwene » 12 Oct 2015 15:59

I kind of like the brutality system. I think the qexp given by each quest should be modified though. I know that has been brought up before, but how frustrating is it to spend a week working on a quest to only get insignificant progress :)

And Kaiya, from experience, the questing will not ever completely offset your brutality. I've done almost all the quests in the game and i'm still extremely brutal at a titan level. It's inevitable that the more you grow, the more brutal you become.

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gold bezie
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by gold bezie » 12 Oct 2015 23:34

Egwene wrote:I kind of like the brutality system. I think the qexp given by each quest should be modified though. I know that has been brought up before, but how frustrating is it to spend a week working on a quest to only get insignificant progress :)

And Kaiya, from experience, the questing will not ever completely offset your brutality. I've done almost all the quests in the game and i'm still extremely brutal at a titan level. It's inevitable that the more you grow, the more brutal you become.
i agree with egwene. The system is good but it needs an update or more quests to do...but i think what we really might need is more wizards to make those quests or the changes. There are a lot of good ideas going around but we cant expect from a free game and from the wizards who are active at the moment to do more than they allready do for us....
Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that.

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Cherek
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Cherek » 13 Oct 2015 17:08

gold bezie wrote:
Egwene wrote:I kind of like the brutality system. I think the qexp given by each quest should be modified though. I know that has been brought up before, but how frustrating is it to spend a week working on a quest to only get insignificant progress :)

And Kaiya, from experience, the questing will not ever completely offset your brutality. I've done almost all the quests in the game and i'm still extremely brutal at a titan level. It's inevitable that the more you grow, the more brutal you become.
i agree with egwene. The system is good but it needs an update or more quests to do...but i think what we really might need is more wizards to make those quests or the changes. There are a lot of good ideas going around but we cant expect from a free game and from the wizards who are active at the moment to do more than they allready do for us....
Well said Egwene. We'd love to update the quests, make them more logical, adjust the XP, etc. Currently we have one wizard working on that, very part time of course, and we have 300+ quests. Soo... yeah. We need more wizards. And wizards who wants to work on just that. As it's a volunteer workforce, we can't really assign wizards to the "most important tasks", since everyone has to find their own motivation, meaning they'll work on what they _want_ to work on. We in the admin can of course suggest things we feel are important but in the end it comes down to the wizard to decide what they want. We actually have gotten a bunch of new wizards lately which is great. But we can never get too many, so keep them wizard applications coming!:)

Aristos
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Aristos » 16 Oct 2015 11:30

Cherek wrote:
gold bezie wrote:
Egwene wrote:I kind of like the brutality system. I think the qexp given by each quest should be modified though. I know that has been brought up before, but how frustrating is it to spend a week working on a quest to only get insignificant progress :)

And Kaiya, from experience, the questing will not ever completely offset your brutality. I've done almost all the quests in the game and i'm still extremely brutal at a titan level. It's inevitable that the more you grow, the more brutal you become.
i agree with egwene. The system is good but it needs an update or more quests to do...but i think what we really might need is more wizards to make those quests or the changes. There are a lot of good ideas going around but we cant expect from a free game and from the wizards who are active at the moment to do more than they allready do for us....
Well said Egwene. We'd love to update the quests, make them more logical, adjust the XP, etc. Currently we have one wizard working on that, very part time of course, and we have 300+ quests. Soo... yeah. We need more wizards. And wizards who wants to work on just that. As it's a volunteer workforce, we can't really assign wizards to the "most important tasks", since everyone has to find their own motivation, meaning they'll work on what they _want_ to work on. We in the admin can of course suggest things we feel are important but in the end it comes down to the wizard to decide what they want. We actually have gotten a bunch of new wizards lately which is great. But we can never get too many, so keep them wizard applications coming!:)
What will that mean to people who have already completed the quests?

We already have the issue of old players having amounts of QEXP unattainable by newcomers since those quests either A) Don't exist anymore, or B) Don't give as much QEXP

These things should be somehow made up for so there isn't any unfair advantage to either being new or old.

Everyone should have the same chances of reaching greatness if they put in the work.

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Cherek
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Cherek » 16 Oct 2015 12:19

Aristos: Yeah I know, that's another problem that needs to be solved. Those who have already made the quests should of course also get the new upgraded rewards. So a new system for distributing quest XP needs to be in place before such changes are made.

The current solution for this is the quest XP cap, which makes sure that even if you have super old quest XP (which few do), the edge over new players is very small since the cap is somewhat above the XP you get from going all of out current quests. The main advantage for these players is that they do not have to do all current quests. But we're talking ancient here. I started playing -97 and all quest XP I got is still available in the game, so would I still be a mortal I would have no advantage over a player created 2015.

Aristos
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Re: Observation on brutality vs. quests

Post by Aristos » 16 Oct 2015 13:09

Cherek wrote:Aristos: Yeah I know, that's another problem that needs to be solved. Those who have already made the quests should of course also get the new upgraded rewards. So a new system for distributing quest XP needs to be in place before such changes are made.

The current solution for this is the quest XP cap, which makes sure that even if you have super old quest XP (which few do), the edge over new players is very small since the cap is somewhat above the XP you get from going all of out current quests. The main advantage for these players is that they do not have to do all current quests. But we're talking ancient here. I started playing -97 and all quest XP I got is still available in the game, so would I still be a mortal I would have no advantage over a player created 2015.
I'll take your word for it since I can't see numbers, but you're doing a wonderful job and I believe you, as I do any wizard who tells me anything.

Just one thing I do have to say is that regardless of the quantity of people who benefit from this, regardless of their age, it is still a reality. A small advantage is still an advantage.

The new system should allow no exceptions whatsoever. No special cases.

Btw, when you say "all our current quests", do you mean those from the orbs or all of them? Keep in mind please that not every newcomer will be able to do all the orb quests. Things will hold you back, things like race, align, and guild affiliations.

So, if we substract those, we're a bit further apart from that cap that gives us equal opportunities.

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