Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Discuss ideas for how to make the game better. Wizards, take note!
Forum rules
- Use common sense and be respectful towards each other at all times, even when disagreeing.
- Do not reveal sensitive game information. Guild secrets, player seconds are examples of things not allowed.
sylphan
Veteran
Posts: 233
Joined: 12 Nov 2017 19:56

Re: Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Post by sylphan » 22 Jan 2021 22:40

I thoroughly agree with Cherek here.

Makfly
Champion
Posts: 612
Joined: 04 Mar 2010 00:36

Re: Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Post by Makfly » 22 Jan 2021 23:22

Cherek wrote:
22 Jan 2021 22:06
Why there is no standard template library that can be pulled and reskinned? Well, because nobody has made one? Or maybe someone has, but only newer libraries use it, and not the ones created in the 90s? I don't know. We have a lot of different libraries... it would be a massive job to go through them all and "standardise" them. Could it be done? Maybe, but is it worth the effort, and will it even make the game better? I think it would be better to invididually fix the worst offenders when it comes to syntaxes, but let them keep their uniqueness.

My whole point was that I think these variances, while quirky, is also part of what Genesis is. If we were a commercial game company, we would likely have standard templayes for all sorts of things, and a coherent theme and feel for the entire game. But we don't, and I personally also think that IS part of the charm as well. It's the same with all our different kind of shops, inns, pubs, and other establishments. Sometimes you buy stuff, sometimes you order it, sometimes you read a menu, sometimes a pricelist, sometimes reading is forbidden so you have to examine pictures, and sometimes it works in some completley different way that requires a whole help file to explain (Hello Bubba). I like that. Another example is guild racks, as different guilds have different ways of sorting their items, some better than others. It's the same with libraries. Some index stuff differently than others, some lets you read things without first "borrowing" a book, some let's you select a book based on a numbers, other require the full title to be entered, etc. I can't help it, but I think it's perfectly fine that it works in different ways in different places. Some libraries are just better than others. I mean, the great library of some famous city would likely have a much better system than a pile of scrolls in a barbarian guild...

I totally understand what you mean, though, and I understand why you feel that way, but I just don't agree :)

But like I said, if the syntaxes are just plain bad and confusing, we should try to fix them, but I don't see the need to standardise every library so it works in exactly the same way everywhere. I think the more we standardise stuff, the more we also lose some of the uniqueness of different places.
I do not agree that things working differently is not a problem, even if I am not as appreciative as you are.
But that is not what we are talking about here. It is not that things work differently, with different syntaxes and such. It is that some libraries simply lack what should be basic functionalities.

Now it is fair enough that we disagree on this, as we have on many things. I'll let it rest then.
Mortimor Makfly - Gnomish Xeno-Anthropologist

User avatar
Cherek
Site Admin
Posts: 3212
Joined: 04 Mar 2010 04:36

Re: Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Post by Cherek » 22 Jan 2021 23:54

What kind of basic functionality are you talking about? Can you provide a specific example? Drazson made an example of libraries where you have to type in the full title to borrow a book, and also an example of caps issue. I think those are syntax issues, and something I absolutely think should be fixed to make it easier to borrow books in those libraries.

Drazson
Hero
Posts: 411
Joined: 24 Jan 2016 21:27

Re: Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Post by Drazson » 23 Jan 2021 07:07

Wait. If having to type the full name is a syntax issue then many (I want to say 50%+) libraries have them.

User avatar
Cherek
Site Admin
Posts: 3212
Joined: 04 Mar 2010 04:36

Re: Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Post by Cherek » 23 Jan 2021 12:30

Drazson wrote:
23 Jan 2021 07:07
Wait. If having to type the full name is a syntax issue then many (I want to say 50%+) libraries have them.
Well, it would of course depend on how long the titles are and if it's case-sensitive or not, and just how annoying it actually is for the player. If the titles are 100 characters and it's case sensitive, than yes, I do think it should be fixed. If it's short titles that are quick to type, and case doesn't matter, then maybe it's not such a big issue? But like I said, I think it's better to try to fix the _worst_ ones, that really are annoying, than to try to create a global library system. It's much more realistic that will happen - if you contact the liege / aop directly about the worst libraries.

Now, I personally don't even think a standardised system is needed here, but even if I agreed that it would be a good idea to make one, I think it would be highly unlikely simply due to the scope of the project (this is also part of the reason why I don't think we should create one). So, contact the appropriate wizard for really bad libraries, explain the issue in as much detail as possible, and a suggestion for a fix if you have an idea for one. That's realistically what we can do about this.

Drazson
Hero
Posts: 411
Joined: 24 Jan 2016 21:27

Re: Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Post by Drazson » 23 Jan 2021 17:47

Cool, reporting the worst ones is the way to go.

Makfly
Champion
Posts: 612
Joined: 04 Mar 2010 00:36

Re: Libraries - (semi)Unified System

Post by Makfly » 24 Jan 2021 15:32

Drazson already mentioned a significant one. Others are lack of access control and one vs more levels of catalogues (I am not a 100% on that last one, I have recheck in game).

A lack of resources, and we have to contact the individual liege, is fair enough.
Mortimor Makfly - Gnomish Xeno-Anthropologist

Post Reply
http://tworzymyatmosfere.pl/przescieradla-jedwabne-z-gumka/