/Roh
Death penalty adjustment needed
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- Use common sense and be respectful towards each other at all times, even when disagreeing.
- Do not reveal sensitive game information. Guild secrets, player seconds are examples of things not allowed.
- Use common sense and be respectful towards each other at all times, even when disagreeing.
- Do not reveal sensitive game information. Guild secrets, player seconds are examples of things not allowed.
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
Not really, that is not in my hands - just in my head.
/Roh
/Roh
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
Buggerrohim wrote:Not really, that is not in my hands - just in my head.
/Roh
Angmar! ANGMAR!! ANGMAR!!!
Pulp Znuga! PULP!!!!
Pulp Znuga! PULP!!!!
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
After some consideration, I've decided what I would really like the most.
The idea of stat progress to be minimal at the top, to have some for of soft-cap on the stats would make it all perfect.
You still get a minimal bonus, but you won't be completely invincible. This way mobs don't have to be recoded, and there won't be too big a difference between the big characters, stat wise.
To catch up with the big players now is almost impossible for new players but with a system like this, at least they'll get a chance to match them instead of almost instant kill in a fight.
The death penalty should probably be lowered to make this work though, at least in PvP. People would be pretty pissed if someone with a lot less XP kill you simply because their stats had been lowered. And I'd actually love to see that XP loss from a PK would be 0... for the first kill of the day. Put a flag on people when they are killed. If they don't want to risk losing XP, they will have to log off and wait until the next day. This will also help smaller players that get attacked by some notorious PKer. They won't lose anything.
You could even make a PvP flag, somewhat like they do in WoW. If you turn it on you can attack other players but the no-XP-loss from PK will be off as well. Innocent people that don't initiate the attacks can then, in relative safety, do their own thing. Specific NPCs like guild NPCs and such should, of course, automatically give you the PvP flag if you hit them. Even if they attack you first (just don't go near unfriendly guilds if you aren't prepared to fight them).
EDIT: Just wanted to say that this was my idea before becoming immortal.
The idea of stat progress to be minimal at the top, to have some for of soft-cap on the stats would make it all perfect.
You still get a minimal bonus, but you won't be completely invincible. This way mobs don't have to be recoded, and there won't be too big a difference between the big characters, stat wise.
To catch up with the big players now is almost impossible for new players but with a system like this, at least they'll get a chance to match them instead of almost instant kill in a fight.
The death penalty should probably be lowered to make this work though, at least in PvP. People would be pretty pissed if someone with a lot less XP kill you simply because their stats had been lowered. And I'd actually love to see that XP loss from a PK would be 0... for the first kill of the day. Put a flag on people when they are killed. If they don't want to risk losing XP, they will have to log off and wait until the next day. This will also help smaller players that get attacked by some notorious PKer. They won't lose anything.
You could even make a PvP flag, somewhat like they do in WoW. If you turn it on you can attack other players but the no-XP-loss from PK will be off as well. Innocent people that don't initiate the attacks can then, in relative safety, do their own thing. Specific NPCs like guild NPCs and such should, of course, automatically give you the PvP flag if you hit them. Even if they attack you first (just don't go near unfriendly guilds if you aren't prepared to fight them).
EDIT: Just wanted to say that this was my idea before becoming immortal.
Last edited by Calador on 25 May 2011 14:30, edited 1 time in total.
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Laurel
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
afaik the current brute + stat-growth system is more or less a soft-cap - at least that's what I gather from my talks with Irk (and his calculations of brute, progress, con, etc.), my own experience and things like "compare stats with freya" ...
sure - some people went an incredibly long way to get there (Irk, Freya, Xar, Fade, etc), but those are the people who will focus on this "minimal bonus" as you described it and reach it often enough to make it worth it
I'm not that kind of a player, who will go another extra 1000miles, to gain 101% of the goal, when I already went 1000miles to reach 98% ... there are such players however and always will be
sure - some people went an incredibly long way to get there (Irk, Freya, Xar, Fade, etc), but those are the people who will focus on this "minimal bonus" as you described it and reach it often enough to make it worth it
I'm not that kind of a player, who will go another extra 1000miles, to gain 101% of the goal, when I already went 1000miles to reach 98% ... there are such players however and always will be
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
Kas idea NEEDS separate thread with a poll.
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
As long as the option of a plain and simple reversal is present as well.sharn wrote:Kas idea NEEDS separate thread with a poll.
Angmar! ANGMAR!! ANGMAR!!!
Pulp Znuga! PULP!!!!
Pulp Znuga! PULP!!!!
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
Hijacked.
*sigh*
*sigh*
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
I agree 100% with the OP. I was actually thinking of starting a similar thread.
I decided to stop playing after I died twice in a row and was denied the xp reward for a very difficult quest (I assume it was because I made a minor mistake.)
The quest system and the death penalty are things that make you feel like you're inhabiting a universe created by and lorded over by the comic book guy from Simpsons.
I.e. I love the good things about Genesis - but I just don't have time to take any more crap from a game. Back in the days when the player base was younger and had a lot of time on it's hands perhaps the death penalty made sense - but not any longer. The death penalty and quests that don't make sense only encourage cheating in the form of boting and quest cheat notes. Perhaps a little off topic - but a lot of important quests in Genesis are completely ridiculously illogical and can't be solved within a reasonable time-frame without cheating. The Zodiac quest for example... The reward is more or less a must have, but the quest cannot be solved by a normal adult person without cheat-type help. Its just stupid. Same goes for some quests in Cadu, Kabal, Drakmere, etc... If someone says they solved the "magic stick" quest in Cadu without help, they are lying. Same goes for the Zodiac quest.
Perhaps a little obtuse - but who would think of building a sand castle, going into it and fighting a knight made of sand to get a bottle!? Perhaps going into a store, buying a bottle of beer and emptying it out... Yeeesss....
We don't all have asberger syndrome or have unlimited time to grind up from death - nor do we have time to be tortured by some geeks from fifteen years ago who thought they were being clever. So wise up and change it already.
I decided to stop playing after I died twice in a row and was denied the xp reward for a very difficult quest (I assume it was because I made a minor mistake.)
The quest system and the death penalty are things that make you feel like you're inhabiting a universe created by and lorded over by the comic book guy from Simpsons.
I.e. I love the good things about Genesis - but I just don't have time to take any more crap from a game. Back in the days when the player base was younger and had a lot of time on it's hands perhaps the death penalty made sense - but not any longer. The death penalty and quests that don't make sense only encourage cheating in the form of boting and quest cheat notes. Perhaps a little off topic - but a lot of important quests in Genesis are completely ridiculously illogical and can't be solved within a reasonable time-frame without cheating. The Zodiac quest for example... The reward is more or less a must have, but the quest cannot be solved by a normal adult person without cheat-type help. Its just stupid. Same goes for some quests in Cadu, Kabal, Drakmere, etc... If someone says they solved the "magic stick" quest in Cadu without help, they are lying. Same goes for the Zodiac quest.
Perhaps a little obtuse - but who would think of building a sand castle, going into it and fighting a knight made of sand to get a bottle!? Perhaps going into a store, buying a bottle of beer and emptying it out... Yeeesss....
We don't all have asberger syndrome or have unlimited time to grind up from death - nor do we have time to be tortured by some geeks from fifteen years ago who thought they were being clever. So wise up and change it already.
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
I think that the problem that many people are pointing towards, is a part of the 'grass is greener' syndrome.
Having more stats and more titles was introduced for a reason - to solve a problem. That problem was that people were getting bored with the game, feeling that they had solved it and had nothing left to really go forward with. Leaving a game in frustration can often be temporary (although, its never good either) as they might one day decide to come back and master a challenge that had beaten them. Leaving a game because of boredom, is forever. People do not go back and spend time on games that have become boring to them.
The death penalty issue, I think this is a very relevant issue in todays game. When I first started playing Genesis in the early 90's, I was a kid just starting university, living in a town far away from my family, and as a result I had a ton of extra time on my hands. Some friends I had met, had just found this game and started playing it, so I had fun and joined the group. Now I am a husband, a father of three young children, and I have a responsibility to bring home a paycheque to support the wife and children in question. The recovery time of a death is not chronological, it is based upon how much playing time you can invest into it. Since my time for a game is considerably less, the impact of a death would be much greater on someone like myself overall - an obstacle that is unlikely to ever be overcome.
The problems are not intrinsic to the game, or the death penalty, or the stat and title levels, it is just that we see something we think we like about the things we don't have, or the things we used to have.
In the end however, the reality is that there are always problems to be solved, and unless the problem is 2 + 2, these problems do not have absolute solutions which do not create new problems. Overcoming these new problems with new solutions, which in turn create other new problems - is our evolution. And I believe it is a good thing, so long as we can keep finding those new solutions.
Having more stats and more titles was introduced for a reason - to solve a problem. That problem was that people were getting bored with the game, feeling that they had solved it and had nothing left to really go forward with. Leaving a game in frustration can often be temporary (although, its never good either) as they might one day decide to come back and master a challenge that had beaten them. Leaving a game because of boredom, is forever. People do not go back and spend time on games that have become boring to them.
The death penalty issue, I think this is a very relevant issue in todays game. When I first started playing Genesis in the early 90's, I was a kid just starting university, living in a town far away from my family, and as a result I had a ton of extra time on my hands. Some friends I had met, had just found this game and started playing it, so I had fun and joined the group. Now I am a husband, a father of three young children, and I have a responsibility to bring home a paycheque to support the wife and children in question. The recovery time of a death is not chronological, it is based upon how much playing time you can invest into it. Since my time for a game is considerably less, the impact of a death would be much greater on someone like myself overall - an obstacle that is unlikely to ever be overcome.
The problems are not intrinsic to the game, or the death penalty, or the stat and title levels, it is just that we see something we think we like about the things we don't have, or the things we used to have.
In the end however, the reality is that there are always problems to be solved, and unless the problem is 2 + 2, these problems do not have absolute solutions which do not create new problems. Overcoming these new problems with new solutions, which in turn create other new problems - is our evolution. And I believe it is a good thing, so long as we can keep finding those new solutions.
Re: Death penalty adjustment needed
fulgrim: Funny you should mention the Zodiac quest. It is a hard one to figure out and still everyone has done it. The reward is great and I used to find it quite fun to do. A death is nasty but atleast you don't lose the exp from the quest.
A lot of us have grown old. We cannot dedicate as much time to playing as we used to, but I don't see that as a problem. We could implement ways to make it a lot easier to become Myth, but is that where the fun in the game is ? Do we want a game like WoW, where only max lvl characters are of importance ?
I think, over the years, people have grown used to the way the MMORPG companies think. You can die but it doesn't really matter. On Genesis survival has always been a key factor in playstyle.
The time needed to recover is the same, no matter if you play 2 hours a week or 8 hours a day. In real life it just takes a bit longer. It is still nasty, but if people have been playing here since the early 90's they should really have grown used to it
A lot of us have grown old. We cannot dedicate as much time to playing as we used to, but I don't see that as a problem. We could implement ways to make it a lot easier to become Myth, but is that where the fun in the game is ? Do we want a game like WoW, where only max lvl characters are of importance ?
I think, over the years, people have grown used to the way the MMORPG companies think. You can die but it doesn't really matter. On Genesis survival has always been a key factor in playstyle.
The time needed to recover is the same, no matter if you play 2 hours a week or 8 hours a day. In real life it just takes a bit longer. It is still nasty, but if people have been playing here since the early 90's they should really have grown used to it
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