Racial stats rebalance

[Budwise]

I must confess that wizards having more knowledge than mortals is not a problem in my book.
I would be worried if they didn't and started messing with game.

So lets see how it pans out. As an elf with balanced stats I guess I won't feel much difference
after a trip to the thaumathurgist.

[zizuph]

Lets imagine that I am a goblin with 1000 strength. My racial bonus to strength is 10%. That means my total strength is now 1100 strength. I like that because as a goblin I hold sticks and beat people.

Standing next to me is a human with 1000 strength. He does the same, but does not hit as hard.

In the new system, we are both 1000. So I lost 100 strength. No amount of thaumaturge visits can give that back.

Do you think the goblin is upset that he is loosing 100 strength that he has had for 30 years? No amount of race changes or stat redistributions is going to make him think loosing those 100 strength is a good idea.

In much fantasy material, goblins are the evil creatures that end up getting slaughtered by the hero elves/humans/dwarves. If we were going to base goblins more closely on thematics, they’d be a great deal weaker than how things are today.

But that would not be fair to goblin players. You should be able to enjoy your race without others having a big advantage over you. The same logic goes for all races.

Likewise evil characters lose in most of the books, yet that would not be fun for those that wanted to play the game as an evil character. That is why the same balance rules apply regardless of alignment. I do recognize that good aligned guilds tend to be stricter in their allowed actions, though that is harder to model fairly into balance.

If you want look at this as Zero Sum, then any unfair advantage you currently have can be easily justified, by complaining about the group you don’t like also having what you have. This is what you have been doing here. Vampires deserve fair stats. SU do. WOHS do. MM do. Archers do. Every guild that is race constrained does. Just because your current guild doesn’t restrict against goblins does not mean that it has earned more benefits from your race than them.

I am sorry that you are disappointed. But it is hard to see how you are taking into consideration everyone else’s enjoyment of the game. AOB work is about making sure everyone has a fair shot, and in this case
It happens to mean humans are very slightly boosted so that everyone else aren’t pushed down in titles. The amount itself is quite tiny, but we are trying to be transparent about all downstream effects we expect.

I hope you can appreciate that we want everyone to have a fair shot, not just the ones who happened to pick one specific race.

[Quantum]

I think I'll try putting up a compromise once more.

A lot of people with a lot of races feel they are unduly punished here.

Is the racial rebalance a good idea? In essence yes, but 25-30 years too late?

A compromise to bring races closer together is to reduce racial stats by 50%

50% less plus and minus. Brings races closer together, but without goblins, elves and kender feeling like they are gutted. Kender had immense dexterity, and now they are as dextrous as dwarves? From a roleplaying perspective that makes no sense. From a stat perspective in the current system it makes no sense.

So don't ruin it 100%, just 50%.

[Drazson]

Ah, Quantum. Picking that disheveled mass of muscle of a creature for RP purposes and now that they're probably Saurian - or maybe something else who knows and who cares it's very accelerated RP after all - you want to mess it up for poor Quantum. Meanies.

And in extension, all those dedicated human players that suddenly left guilds all around the Donut to grow fangs overnight are now rewarded for all that dedication to their ex guild. Well, until something glittered significantly, but it was still dedication.

[Quantum]

Ah, Quantum. Picking that disheveled mass of muscle of a creature for RP purposes and now that they're probably Saurian - or maybe something else who knows and who cares it's very accelerated RP after all - you want to mess it up for poor Quantum. Meanies.

And in extension, all those dedicated human players that suddenly left guilds all around the Donut to grow fangs overnight are now rewarded for all that dedication to their ex guild. Well, until something glittered significantly, but it was still dedication.

What is your point?

[Chanele]

I think I'll try putting up a compromise once more.

A lot of people with a lot of races feel they are unduly punished here.

Is the racial rebalance a good idea? In essence yes, but 25-30 years too late?

A compromise to bring races closer together is to reduce racial stats by 50%

50% less plus and minus. Brings races closer together, but without goblins, elves and kender feeling like they are gutted. Kender had immense dexterity, and now they are as dextrous as dwarves? From a roleplaying perspective that makes no sense. From a stat perspective in the current system it makes no sense.

So don't ruin it 100%, just 50%.

You are a powerplayer and will pick whatever race makes you most powerful so having goblin base is a natural choice. This is about making all races viable and playable for any type of roleplay, you can play a goblin caster or an elf fighter...what is wrong with that?

If you read the replies from wizards in this thread your daily experience will not be much different from today, an automaton with a start button.

/Chanele

[Nerull]

Toss in some disguise for goblins to enter MT for questing purposes since the amount of xp locked in there is quite substantial? If we want proper balance parity, it probably should entail most of the available questxp that the game offers aswell, for all races. Oh, same for goblin and questchains elsewhere (vk?).

Just some thoughts.

Yes. It's on my docket of things to do. Cherek and I tried to get you to volunteer to code it a while back. Are you raising your hand now?

Not yet - too limited time due to todders, so my time is spent on domain and guild maintenance atm

[Quantum]

I think I'll try putting up a compromise once more.

A lot of people with a lot of races feel they are unduly punished here.

Is the racial rebalance a good idea? In essence yes, but 25-30 years too late?

A compromise to bring races closer together is to reduce racial stats by 50%

50% less plus and minus. Brings races closer together, but without goblins, elves and kender feeling like they are gutted. Kender had immense dexterity, and now they are as dextrous as dwarves? From a roleplaying perspective that makes no sense. From a stat perspective in the current system it makes no sense.

So don't ruin it 100%, just 50%.

You are a powerplayer and will pick whatever race makes you most powerful so having goblin base is a natural choice. This is about making all races viable and playable for any type of roleplay, you can play a goblin caster or an elf fighter...what is wrong with that?

If you read the replies from wizards in this thread your daily experience will not be much different from today, an automaton with a start button.

/Chanele

All of this comming from a powerplayer who joins whatever guild you perceive to be the strongest. That's rich...I suppose it takes one to know one.

And no, I am not an automaton with a start button. I leave that to the vampires.

[Nerull]

I slightly miss the point with the vamps though - they just happen to be locked to humans due to thematic reasons, but all other races "gets the same buff" aswell, regardless of guild affiliations?

[TaranGoatWalker]

I think I'll try putting up a compromise once more.

A lot of people with a lot of races feel they are unduly punished here.

Is the racial rebalance a good idea? In essence yes, but 25-30 years too late?

A compromise to bring races closer together is to reduce racial stats by 50%

50% less plus and minus. Brings races closer together, but without goblins, elves and kender feeling like they are gutted. Kender had immense dexterity, and now they are as dextrous as dwarves? From a roleplaying perspective that makes no sense. From a stat perspective in the current system it makes no sense.

So don't ruin it 100%, just 50%.

Doesn't solve that the numbers not adding up.