Genesis Forums

I will stubborny continue to claim that I do not think there are something fundementally wrong with the core of Genesis.

Yes, as in all types of creative work there are mistakes, problems, less-than-perfect parts, but we're always gonna have that. We also have tons of really great stuff.

I still think everything should be focused on improvemets that bring new players, and keep new players, since I think ALOT of the other problems we have will fix themselves with new players. Yes, maybe even this.

More players means more interaction, more RP, more guild stuff, more politics, more pvp, and possible less script-grinding because the other parts of the game is suddenly fun again. Thus not everyone will hunt XP as badly.

We need new players, and if we get it, it will take alot of time before they reach huge sizes. I think this problem should be dealt with then, if it is a problem then, and like Gorboth said, when we can afford to lose a part of the population to a drastic change.

About size of players. I remember 96-98, when i was total noob. And i remember, what "immortal champs" needed to team to kill Deppie or Golem. Now, how many NPCs we have what can't be handled by huge myth alone? One? Two? Can Irk get chrystal axe solo? Sure he can. Can Pasha solo Megula? Dunno. Can any myth or legend kill solo goblin eldar? In 96 immortal champ was in need of Calian in backpack to kill eldar. So, there is not necessary to team now except for grinding. There is uber-puper-mega EQ what handled by some NPC. Make it fucking dangerous even for uberchars. I remember immortal champs was killed by Deppie when was in team of 4 or 5. And that without death recovery system and with bigger death penalty. So, let just make some improvment in 5-10 NPCs to make it really dangerous for uberchars. Don't encrease combat XP they give. That will bring some fun back from old days, i think.

Davvol wrote:About size of players. I remember 96-98, when i was total noob. And i remember, what "immortal champs" needed to team to kill Deppie or Golem. Now, how many NPCs we have what can't be handled by huge myth alone? One? Two? Can Irk get chrystal axe solo? Sure he can. Can Pasha solo Megula? Dunno. Can any myth or legend kill solo goblin eldar? In 96 immortal champ was in need of Calian in backpack to kill eldar. So, there is not necessary to team now except for grinding. There is uber-puper-mega EQ what handled by some NPC. Make it fucking dangerous even for uberchars. I remember immortal champs was killed by Deppie when was in team of 4 or 5. And that without death recovery system and with bigger death penalty. So, let just make some improvment in 5-10 NPCs to make it really dangerous for uberchars. Don't encrease combat XP they give. That will bring some fun back from old days, i think.

I totally agree. Either create a few new mega-monsters, or increase some old. (with warnings first of course).

However, I do think they should give more XP! I think if you spend the time getting a team to slay one of the new uber-chars, I think you also should get a great XP reward. This could be a (dangerous) but also more social way of gaining XP than the usual grind of tons of smaller things that is both pretty boring and pretty safe for the most part.

I'd love to se an NPC that takes like 5 (or more) players to kill also would provide each of the team members with a nice XP-gain. Say an average Legend can grind himself to a "little" progress in two hours (dont know exactly, but it sounds reasonable perhaps?). Say getting a team, preparing, (potions? herbs? resistance-items?) and slaying the NPC also takes two hours. If sucecceding, every team member also gets a "little" progress each. I would find that way of gaining XP more fun than the usual grind. Perhaps it should even be a little more rewarding than usual grind considering it will most likely be a little more risky.

You could go creative, it does not have to be ONE mega-monster, could be a small dungeon where monsters become bigger and bigger leading to the boss too, or other small things like "defend this camp for 30 min" or "storm this castle and kill the leader". This type of thing would of course be "instances" so every team that enters, enters their own dungeon. That way you wont be disappointed the thing is dead when you arrive or something like that.

But a "one big NPC" would be the easiest way to go, and could also work by just upgrading current ones.

I agree these teams were alot of fun in the past, and they didnt even give you any XP. I think this could become a great alternative to grinding that would be way more social, more exciting, but just as rewarding as the usual grind.

Will it make people grow quicker? No, I dont think so, getting a team and coordinating it is going to take some time, no matter how much connections and friends you got andthe NPC would require some preparation in terms of getting special items or herbs perhaps, all in all it would take some time to accomplish. And eventually a few people would die, which basically never happens when grinding.

What if you cant get a team? Dont like to team? There is not enough players to team with? Well then there is always the usual grind which still is rewarding.

Davvol wrote:About size of players. I remember 96-98, when i was total noob. And i remember, what "immortal champs" needed to team to kill Deppie or Golem. Now, how many NPCs we have what can't be handled by huge myth alone? One? Two? Can Irk get chrystal axe solo? Sure he can. Can Pasha solo Megula? Dunno. Can any myth or legend kill solo goblin eldar? In 96 immortal champ was in need of Calian in backpack to kill eldar. So, there is not necessary to team now except for grinding. There is uber-puper-mega EQ what handled by some NPC. Make it fucking dangerous even for uberchars. I remember immortal champs was killed by Deppie when was in team of 4 or 5. And that without death recovery system and with bigger death penalty. So, let just make some improvment in 5-10 NPCs to make it really dangerous for uberchars. Don't encrease combat XP they give. That will bring some fun back from old days, i think.

I totally agree. Either create a few new mega-monsters, or increase some old. (with warnings first of course).

However, I do think they should give more XP! I think if you spend the time getting a team to slay one of the new uber-chars, I think you also should get a great XP reward. This could be a (dangerous) but also more social way of gaining XP than the usual grind of tons of smaller things that is both pretty boring and pretty safe for the most part.

I'd love to se an NPC that takes like 5 (or more) players to kill also would provide each of the team members with a nice XP-gain. Say an average Legend can grind himself to a "little" progress in two hours (dont know exactly, but it sounds reasonable perhaps?). Say getting a team, preparing, (potions? herbs? resistance-items?) and slaying the NPC also takes two hours. If sucecceding, every team member also gets a "little" progress each. I would find that way of gaining XP more fun than the usual grind. Perhaps it should even be a little more rewarding than usual grind considering it will most likely be a little more risky.

You could go creative, it does not have to be ONE mega-monster, could be a small dungeon where monsters become bigger and bigger leading to the boss too, or other small things like "defend this camp for 30 min" or "storm this castle and kill the leader". This type of thing would of course be "instances" so every team that enters, enters their own dungeon. That way you wont be disappointed the thing is dead when you arrive or something like that.

But a "one big NPC" would be the easiest way to go, and could also work by just upgrading current ones.

I agree these teams were alot of fun in the past, and they didnt even give you any XP. I think this could become a great alternative to grinding that would be way more social, more exciting, but just as rewarding as the usual grind.

Will it make people grow quicker? No, I dont think so, getting a team and coordinating it is going to take some time, no matter how much connections and friends you got and the NPC would require some preparation in terms of getting special items or herbs perhaps, all in all it would take some time to accomplish. And eventually a few people would die, which basically never happens when grinding.

What if you cant get a team? Dont like to team? There is not enough players to team with? Well then there is always the usual grind which still is rewarding. And this could be a nice break in the grind when you do manage to find a team big enough.

XP or not - depends on moster. If it has a nice peace of EQ - it's enough. If it just fukken big ass-reaper without good eq - than XP should be reward. I will be happy to see wise troll what can be killed only by team of 3 myths-legends. Or goblin eldar kicking ass of ubermyth. Or shadow-elf or Jadestone able to send some legends far away wimping. Or Gorgun able to protect himself from champ-legend. And so on. There is legend+ level eq holders. They should be nasty.

How about adding special properties to the grind zones that you can't enter them past champion? It would make easy to grow to this point and very hard afterwards. It might also stem some player interaction since legends and myths wouldn't be able to obtain certain items that are present in the hero-champion great exp zones.

Edit:
@ Cherek:
The problem with creating uber-monsters is that you're banning smaller players from enjoyment (they can't assist in most places people go this days anyway). But on the other hand it becomes 'end game content' of sorts, where you need to grow to access them.

This coupled with the idea posted above would create several 'funnel zones', where you want certain sized players to be.
General grind zones for people up to champion and special NPC's with some grand items and nice rewards for legend+ sized players where smaller ones can't even enter.

Could be an interesting mechanic.

how about NO stat cap... Zip.. nada.. Nay.. Nain ! Njiet ! kaputski!! nej, Hell no !

Rhaegar wrote:How about adding special properties to the grind zones that The problem with creating uber-monsters is that you're banning smaller players from enjoyment (they can't assist in most places people go this days anyway). But on the other hand it becomes 'end game content' of sorts, where you need to grow to access them.

You wrong. Being veteran-newbie champ i was able to assit on deppie with team of Pasha and Vgi. Yes, i almost died that time, but that was fun.
Also, being modern champion i was unable to assist on Gamalus 2 weeks ago. I don't think it right, because he's little sucker, an all his power is in burning and mana. After he's out of mana - he don't do damage.
So, don't make things BIG statwise, make it dangerous. Breaking armours, blocking exit, stuning, blinding, firing fucking fireballs, spitting acid, summoning hella lot of guards and such. Even middle level chars will be able to assit, but due to nasty specials, block or lot of guards it will be dangerous foe.

Rhaegar wrote:This coupled with the idea posted above would create several 'funnel zones', where you want certain sized players to be.
General grind zones for people up to champion and special NPC's with some grand items and nice rewards for legend+ sized players where smaller ones can't even enter.

Could be an interesting mechanic.

Aha, and remove interaction between myths and heros. So, 15 active players, 7 Myths, 5 legends and lesser. As result, 12 from 15 are siting in Terel or Mithas with boting scripts, and rest 3 players trying to find some fun in that game. Very nice

BTW, back to stats question. How many players Genesis lost after first statdowngrade? Do we have such statistics?

I dont get this cap issue at all.. yes some grow insainly huge.. and some dont.. to bad for them, those who grows insainely huge spends alot of time in doing so, and shouldnt be punished by a sudden cap because the casual player cant keep up.. to bad for the casual player.. thats why there are these neutral grinding zones for the myths, to bring heroes and vets on a tag along..

as i see it, invoking a cap, or downgrading people is a very very seriously bad thing to do. when the first cap came or stat drop as it was called, Most of the population vanished, and proberly what we see now is what remained, and the occational old fart logging on once in a while. Im glad to see newplayers come tho.
but a cap would remove peoples will to continue this.. If you want it to be more fair to you, Play more, grind more, quest more.. dont suggest caps to punish myths and legends because you cant keep up. its simply wrong..

You can nerf guilds, make npcs harder and change equipment, but dont mess with my stats.. !