Genesis Forums

kirsach wrote: Sorry Cherek but you are wrong. Peace is not boring. PvP is boring and force me and other to stóp play or switch to alt. Im even ready to pay higher tax for not participate in any PvP. I just want to grow. I wanmt to hit extr. Violent Brute and make 3 progresses per 8h of play. And I know many people such as me.

Bonk had the same oppinion as me. Do you remember mail action we make several months ago sending mails to wizards and Keepers against autohunt trigs and generalyy aginst pvp?

Wrong? How can I be wrong about MY opinion?:) I think if there were no conflicts in Genesis it would be boring. But that's what I think. I understand others feel differently and simply want to play a co-op game in peace, if that's what you prefer.

Like Draugor said it IS possible to stay out of conflicts and PVP though, but your RP and guild choices must also reflect your pacifistic ways. And it requires being very careful when grinding as well, as a stolen kill (usually due to poor scripts), or being in an area that someone has decided to protect, or keep to themselves, can be enough to end up in PVP. It's possible to stay out of it though, I've managed as a player in the past to stay from any conflict in a very long time, but it requires to make an effort to NOT get involved.

I do remember your autohunt campaign, and it worked didn't it? It's been banned for some time now.

Anyway, my point was that for those who want to PVP, there is definitely room for improvement in the PVP system so that more people can find it fun.

Yes, Campaign worked and I didnt heard or read any oppinion it was wrong decission. Regarding guild that "allow" stay out of war Im not sure there are such if as I wrote few days ago even Monks were a target as a whole guild and several Monks for sure not involved in any PvP were killed (eg Grampal). So who you can join to stay outside the war? Archers? SS?

Cherek wrote:As for peace. Im my opinion, peace in the real world is awesome, peace in Genesis is boring. Ultimately we should be able to offer a PVP system where war is _fun_, and players should not feel they have to negotiate peace just because they feel they are hurting someone too badly. Which I suspect is the case here? Correct me if I am wrong please, but would you not really prefer the war going on, and you could continue fighting? Because you enjoy fighting? For that to happen we need to find a way to make guild wars fun for more than a handful of players though.

Naaaaw, you assume I have a heart. How sweet of you.

Theory:

The new (and younger) players represent the next generation players. They play games with virtually no difficulty, but with great stories and high entertainment value. Which is fine. I enjoyed "easy" games like the Assassin's Creed-series immensely, but I also put it on the shelf after one play-though and never looked back. I have a whole shelf full of these kinds of games, and they're all collecting dust.

Genesis is a difficult game. It has become significantly less difficult with new and improved quest docs, maps, recovery etc., but it is still damn difficult.

Every time I hear someone talk about changing things regarding PvP I can't help but feel conservative, defensive and a little bewildered, because I've of the mind that Genesis is fun because it is hard, dangerous and frustrating.

While joining a powerful guild increases rewards, it also increases risk - especially if it's at war! And even as a mercenary or gladiator, there's always a griefer who fancies the golden gauntlets you purchased for your last plats at the auction house and kills you for it.

Restricting, changing the mechanics or otherwise fiddle with how we PvP, changes the game. It makes it easier. Genesis is fun because it's challenging and subsequently rewarding when you've overcome said challenges.

Genesis is not Assassins Creed. It's not Prince of Persia. There's no save option. There's no reverse time. Genesis is a god damn difficult game that's been MUCH more difficult in the past, and getting killed by another player is part of said difficulty. Genesis has always had PvP. It still breathes. It's unique. It's fucking Genesis!

I don't like to say it, as I do like the influx of new blood, but if you have a problem with PvP, you're playing the wrong fucking game.

kirsach wrote:Yes, Polska Campaign worked and I didnt heard or read any oppinion it was wrong decission. Regarding guild that "allow" stay out of war Im not sure there are such if as I wrote few days ago even Monks were a target as a whole guild and several Monks for sure not involved in any PvP were killed (eg Grampal). So who you can join to stay outside the war? Archers? SS?

Balhut and Seren had attacked several times, when the DO council refused to take action against them for those rule-breaks, Fluffy got pissed, so that could have been avoided.

Cherek wrote:

kirsach wrote: Sorry Cherek but you are wrong. Peace is not boring. PvP is boring and force me and other to stóp play or switch to alt. Im even ready to pay higher tax for not participate in any PvP. I just want to grow. I wanmt to hit extr. Violent Brute and make 3 progresses per 8h of play. And I know many people such as me.

Bonk had the same oppinion as me. Do you remember mail action we make several months ago sending mails to wizards and Keepers against autohunt trigs and generalyy aginst pvp?

Wrong? How can I be wrong about MY opinion?:) I think if there were no conflicts in Genesis it would be boring. But that's what I think. I understand others feel differently and simply want to play a co-op game in peace, if that's what you prefer.

Like Draugor said it IS possible to stay out of conflicts and PVP though, but your RP and guild choices must also reflect your pacifistic ways. And it requires being very careful when grinding as well, as a stolen kill (usually due to poor scripts), or being in an area that someone has decided to protect, or keep to themselves, can be enough to end up in PVP. It's possible to stay out of it though, I've managed as a player in the past to stay from any conflict in a very long time, but it requires to make an effort to NOT get involved.

I do remember your autohunt campaign, and it worked didn't it? It's been banned for some time now.

Anyway, my point was that for those who want to PVP, there is definitely room for improvement in the PVP system so that more people can find it fun.

Just to satisfy my own curiosity, what is the administration's opinion on the current status of guilds on the subject of PVP? Completely ignoring PVE aspects, is the current disparate levels of power a function of unfinished recodes? Is it intended that there be only a small number of guilds that are viable to pvp with, or should all the guilds be viable in some way? Of course, not every guild is going to fit every role (although the precedent exists), and that is understood by most I would think. However, for example, we have a great number of melee guilds and the power those guilds have is vastly different. I personally have a deep, abiding hatred for "roleplay" and other completely subjective factors being justifications for power. I see no possible way to justify that and say we are going to work towards balanced PVP. Thoughts?

Dread wrote:
Just to satisfy my own curiosity, what is the administration's opinion on the current status of guilds on the subject of PVP? Completely ignoring PVE aspects, is the current disparate levels of power a function of unfinished recodes? Is it intended that there be only a small number of guilds that are viable to pvp with, or should all the guilds be viable in some way? Of course, not every guild is going to fit every role (although the precedent exists), and that is understood by most I would think. However, for example, we have a great number of melee guilds and the power those guilds have is vastly different. I personally have a deep, abiding hatred for "roleplay" and other completely subjective factors being justifications for power. I see no possible way to justify that and say we are going to work towards balanced PVP. Thoughts?

Most guilds are very viable to pvp with, they just require special tactics and/or size and preferably gear.
Sure, neidar are bitchy due to the lack of damage. But most guilds are very viable

nils wrote:I don't like to say it, as I do like the influx of new blood, but if you have a problem with PvP, you're playing the wrong fucking game.

I would like to agree with you, but I can't. I love PVP. The only reason I play video games is to PVP. Unfortunately:

A. Genesis has become a haven for power-grinding, stat/size worshipping automatons.
B. The guilds are wildly out of balance.
C. There are a number of people (Whether or not that number is significant, I have no idea. Some philosophies would state that any number greater than 0 should be significant.) that don't want to pvp.
D...
E...

Choose your own reason. It matters not, they are all valid to different people. What I can say for certain is I had a lot more fun in this game back when champ was it, we had no recovery, and there was a lot more pvp.

gorboth wrote:

Code: Select all

Esteemed warriors of the Realm,

Today, the player Bonk requested that I delete him and all of his
various characters. It is always a shame when I get this request, and I
usually try to talk people out of it. I was not able to talk him out of it.
According to Bonk, the way various people in the realm are using the war
as an excuse to target people of opposing factions has become a situation
fraught with grief and ruination of any fun. He claims that people
intentionally target players they know are not players who enjoy or wish
to conduct pvp, and try to kill them as often as possible. If this is true,
I would be sad to hear it. Genesis has a history of pvp that can be quite
fun. Sadly, it has been a very long time since I heard general consensus
that our current options for fun player conflict are reliable. It will,
of course, always come down at some level to people using the system in a
way that promotes fun and fairness rather than grief. Heh. What a silly
thing to even say.

This game is always in your hands, esteemed fellow Genesis enthusiasts.
What you do with it creates your reality. Is your current reality a good
one?

G.

Stand up and fight! Try at least...

B.

Draugor wrote:

Dread wrote:
Just to satisfy my own curiosity, what is the administration's opinion on the current status of guilds on the subject of PVP? Completely ignoring PVE aspects, is the current disparate levels of power a function of unfinished recodes? Is it intended that there be only a small number of guilds that are viable to pvp with, or should all the guilds be viable in some way? Of course, not every guild is going to fit every role (although the precedent exists), and that is understood by most I would think. However, for example, we have a great number of melee guilds and the power those guilds have is vastly different. I personally have a deep, abiding hatred for "roleplay" and other completely subjective factors being justifications for power. I see no possible way to justify that and say we are going to work towards balanced PVP. Thoughts?

Most guilds are very viable to pvp with, they just require special tactics and/or size and preferably gear.
Sure, neidar are bitchy due to the lack of damage. But most guilds are very viable

Perhaps we should start another thread and actually make a list and tag them viable/non-viable with some reasoning. I could definitely be wrong, but I think "most" is an overstatement.


*** EDIT *** If we do so, we also need to discount gear/size. My argument is given equal size and equal gear.

Dread wrote:

Draugor wrote:

Dread wrote:
Just to satisfy my own curiosity, what is the administration's opinion on the current status of guilds on the subject of PVP? Completely ignoring PVE aspects, is the current disparate levels of power a function of unfinished recodes? Is it intended that there be only a small number of guilds that are viable to pvp with, or should all the guilds be viable in some way? Of course, not every guild is going to fit every role (although the precedent exists), and that is understood by most I would think. However, for example, we have a great number of melee guilds and the power those guilds have is vastly different. I personally have a deep, abiding hatred for "roleplay" and other completely subjective factors being justifications for power. I see no possible way to justify that and say we are going to work towards balanced PVP. Thoughts?

Most guilds are very viable to pvp with, they just require special tactics and/or size and preferably gear.
Sure, neidar are bitchy due to the lack of damage. But most guilds are very viable

Perhaps we should start another thread and actually make a list and tag them viable/non-viable with some reasoning. I could definitely be wrong, but I think "most" is an overstatement.


*** EDIT *** If we do so, we also need to discount gear/size. My argument is given equal size and equal gear.

Please do so, you'll notice that most guilds are pvpable tho, not all are good for blitzattacks like the BDA, morguls or Calians, but still very useable