Racial stats rebalance

[Quantum]

<derail>
A racial that makes you undead, and does nothing else would be interesting.
I for one think that undead life (never having been undead) sounds easier than living person life... and surely if undeads are so balanced, and not taxed for (?) there'd be no AoB objection to such a thing?
I wonder how many would join such a racial. I suspect many. Free DV. No need for food. Maybe some laymans not working (heals) would be annoying... not like herbs are used by the majority of players though...
</derail>

Wiz and code it. As long as it's not ridiculous from a balance and theme perspective I don't see any reason to stop a wizard who wants to make it happen.

I think I heard Taran volunteered for it. I'm almost sure. More sure than my knowledge of goblin populations. Which admittedly isn't saying much it would appear.

My question still stands, maybe because I'm getting old. Which options are currently on the table? It would be useful if we could limit our conversation to what is actually a possibility.

[TaranGoatWalker]

From a balance perspective, such a guild would be allowed? That makes all joiners undead, and just that?
It was more a thought experiment ; when (if) I wiz, I doubt I'll start off like that something smaller, I'd hope.

On that note... can I ask whether vamps get advantages for the whole damage in sunlight thing? Extra caid for disadvantages, that is?
Fair 'nuff if answer won't be given.

P.S.
Changes look groovy. Consultation even groovier.

[Shesara]

I would like to thank the Wizarding community for working hard on this for such a long time.

I have gotten the answers I needed, and I think this is going to be good for the game. As I already noted earlier, I have waited for this to happen for ages, so I am biased.

When we are challenged by changes, we sometimes learn new skills or new ways to tackle situations. I have no doubt we will do the same this time. All races, except humans, will be different to play and I cannot wait to see what that will be like.

[Kvator]

Also from the same post by cherek - Looking at the goblin population, the vast majority seem to be goodaligned. I do not know the entire population, but from the rankings there is one evil - Cassius. On the good side you have Zhabou, Bonk, Madmanmat, Quantum and Seren. A 5 to 1 factor of goodies. Why? Because good players have vastly more options than evils.

and that's why u picked 3 monks (neutral btw) and 2 calians?

[nils]

The post is now child-proofed.

[Quantum]

Also from the same post by cherek - Looking at the goblin population, the vast majority seem to be goodaligned. I do not know the entire population, but from the rankings there is one evil - Cassius. On the good side you have Zhabou, Bonk, Madmanmat, Quantum and Seren. A 5 to 1 factor of goodies. Why? Because good players have vastly more options than evils.

and that's why u picked 3 monks (neutral btw) and 2 calians?

It sounds like you only think good-aligned characters are good because of their guild. In that case let me re-phrase my sentence.

Based on the 6 players listed above and their guilds, 4 are neutral, 2 are good. No one is evil.

This does not infer that there are no evil goblins, just that the 6 players in top 20 that I mentioned are not. Is that more correct?

[cyork2]

+1 for wiping combat exp (-1 for wiping quest xp... I don't want to repeat the same quests all over again and if someone is at max quest xp they can still do quests they skipped).

I agree with the core point Nils was making, Genesis is not great 'in spite of' it's core mechanics it is great because of them.

[Kvator]

This does not infer that there are no evil goblins, just that the 6 players in top 20 that I mentioned are not. Is that more correct?

but what's your point there?

- all evils can kill evil grind areas np while in some good guilds (Knights, OotS) you can get screwed after killing single good-aligned mob
- it's easier (or rather quicker) to 'fix' evil align than good one
- a lot of thematically evil areas were changed to neutral for evils QoL

for majority of time it's easier for evil chars, with two exceptions that come to mind:
- questing early on (but this is being fixed by wizards making alternate solutions to different quests)
- endgame turbo-scripting on Myth+++ (it can be just as easy for any align)

[zizuph]

+1 for wiping combat exp (-1 for wiping quest xp... I don't want to repeat the same quests all over again and if someone is at max quest xp they can still do quests they skipped).

I agree with the core point Nils was making, Genesis is not great 'in spite of' it's core mechanics it is great because of them.

There was a time when the stats were recalculated, so the total experience was worth less towards stats. Half the player base quit the game after that. For Nils' "hardcore" ideas, many people have families and lives, and do not enjoy going through all that work all over again, just so that the end-game content is hard to beat again. History has taught us that taking away a huge chunk of someone's past efforts just because, does not make for a positive experience.

As for the rest, I have a different take. Genesis is great because it has a lot to discover, and a lot of very fun people to enjoy. Combat mechanics facilitate one small part of that interaction (characters versus each other, characters versus NPCs), and lack of fairness creates a very negative effect.

That decisions were made by someone 30 years (in the race case, this was actually done to encourage non-humans and non-elves, when racials were very much lacking) does not mean they were great. We've changed how many of the stats worked over time, resolved many scenarios that guaranteed a player a win over another, and none of those brought the house down. Even the racial modifiers today do not match what they were back then - they already have been toned down once. Here, we open up more roleplay versatility, and work on alternative ways to provide stat flexibility.

[Cherek]

This thread has unfortunately derailed completely, which was not unexpected to be honest. There are so many forum rule violations (“be respectful towards each other at all times”) and so many completely off topic posts that I think this thread is beyond saving. I am sorry to all of you who provided respectful and good feedback, but there is so much negativity and rudeness from many of the older players that I don’t see this leading anywhere good from now on.

We really gave it a shot to include the community in this change, and me, Ckrik, and Zizuph tried to answer your concerns as politely as respectfully as possible, but this simply is a lost cause.

We will continue to discuss this within the AoB/Admin, and you will be informed when we have made a final decision. This thread is now locked.