Problems & Solutions, by yours truly.

[nils]

Love how wizards derail my thread. Awesome work guys.

[Goirbagh]

Love how wizards derail my thread. Awesome work guys.

Hey Nils - I truly get your frustration. I think what you (and I) are looking for, however, is just a concept you won't find easily. I like the word "stringens." If you're from Sweden, you'll be familiar with it for sure. It's a dying concept I think, and it describes well the opposite of this new "everything to everyone" way of thinking hype that is currently going on.

I get it - you're looking for reason, thinking, discussion, numbers, crunching data, massaging ideas. That's not what Genesis is now. I think the wizards will disagree and say "hey Goirbagh, of course we're doing all of that." They likely will not understand - not because they're evil, but because they're unable to.

I, too, want a more serious discussion on things, but nowadays, everyone is a snowflake, and if you're not just expressing your happiness and virtue signaling, then you are de facto wrong no matter how right you are. Today, it's about "everyone should just be happy, screw choices and consequences, screw effort" and so on rather than the old school ways you're trying to find here (at least according to my interpretation of what you're saying).

No constructive input here, just handing out sympathy for your cause.

[Cherek]

Love how wizards derail my thread. Awesome work guys.

Oh stop it. You made a long post with a lot of stuff in it. Zhar replied to one part of your post and jokingly pointed out a flaw in your it, and then Tapakah, also jokingly, said a race like that would be 90% tax. Nobody is trying to derail your thread here, and it's very easy to steer it back in the direction you want, if you want to.

[Cherek]

I think the wizards will disagree and say "hey Goirbagh, of course we're doing all of that." They likely will not understand - not because they're evil, but because they're unable to.

[zizuph]

Hey Nils - I truly get your frustration. I think what you (and I) are looking for, however, is just a concept you won't find easily. I like the word "stringens." If you're from Sweden, you'll be familiar with it for sure. It's a dying concept I think, and it describes well the opposite of this new "everything to everyone" way of thinking hype that is currently going on.

I get it - you're looking for reason, thinking, discussion, numbers, crunching data, massaging ideas. That's not what Genesis is now. I think the wizards will disagree and say "hey Goirbagh, of course we're doing all of that." They likely will not understand - not because they're evil, but because they're unable to.

I, too, want a more serious discussion on things, but nowadays, everyone is a snowflake, and if you're not just expressing your happiness and virtue signaling, then you are de facto wrong no matter how right you are. Today, it's about "everyone should just be happy, screw choices and consequences, screw effort" and so on rather than the old school ways you're trying to find here (at least according to my interpretation of what you're saying).

No constructive input here, just handing out sympathy for your cause.

Let me put out a third option here. Decision making for things like involves a calculus, looking at many different effects, and the psychological effects as well (which of course are non-deterministic, or if you believe in Determinism, incomputable). When you apply different weights to different factors, you will come to a different decision. But it does not mean you are unaware of the other factors, or have some hidden 'evil' weight, or the like. Your opinions on where the weights differ from ours. "Goblins must be the best in melee" can be claimed to be very important thematically to some people, but that doesn't mean we cannot understand it. Our values system may differ from yours, and Cherek has gone out of his way to try to understand many people's feelings on this.

So, let's have a serious discussion. You want a high difficulty game, there are plenty of roguelikes to pick up. Tons of single player games that have amazing stories, and can be true to theme. But when you play a game where you can kill other players, I strongly believe fairness trumps thematics. This has been an issue forever and a day, I have modelled the numbers and spent many hours verifying the impact, and I will commit my time to see it done.

As for the long term equipment change, a large number of players are casual gamers, and this greatly improved their ability to play on the schedule they have. I think the 24/7 idling that certain players do should not be encouraged, and a rollback would cause much more of that. I personally would like to see magical items spawn more often, particularly when breakable ones break through combat. The idea the idea of undoing this improvement is ill-informed, to say the least.

And I think that anyone who feels they have earned the right to insult wizards, try to ruin their mortal's gameplay, or run conspiracy campaigns against them, all because they don't like decisions (or potential decisions), should be reminded that we go out of our way to not do any of those things back to you. Cut out the vitriol, and treat others with respect. You are hurting the community with the discourse. Be responsible for your actions - as wizards we are most certainly held accountable for everything we do, and every interaction we have. We lose players regularly to this.

[Mersereau]

So, let's have a serious discussion. You want a high difficulty game, there are plenty of roguelikes to pick up. Tons of single player games that have amazing stories, and can be true to theme. But when you play a game where you can kill other players, I strongly believe fairness trumps thematics. This has been an issue forever and a day, I have modelled the numbers and spent many hours verifying the impact, and I will commit my time to see it done.

As for the long term equipment change, a large number of players are casual gamers, and this greatly improved their ability to play on the schedule they have. I think the 24/7 idling that certain players do should not be encouraged, and a rollback would cause much more of that. I personally would like to see magical items spawn more often, particularly when breakable ones break through combat. The idea the idea of undoing this improvement is ill-informed, to say the least.

These two paragraphs is the best and most blunt post about most of the nonsense posted on this board I've seen in a very long time.

Well done.

[Snowrose]

Ziz brings up a lot of good points, Ive played on a lot of mmos in the last 20-25 years, some casual some hardcore. and its near impossible to please everyone.

but a lot of choices that benefit pvpers will be bad for casuals or rpers, coices for casual players will upset the classic genesis players,

not to mention a LOT of gamers seem to believe any change that doesn't specifically benefit THEM now is gonna hurt them. or prevent what they want from happening. and or destroy the game so those people will object to things not even hurting them.

back when i played city of heroes the pvpers often got upset if new outfits came out, cause they felt it was preventing new pvp areas from being developed. it was explained it was not even the same developers, the costume developers didn't even touch pvp stuff.

so one patch the "art team" got together and made something very special for those pvpers. they didn't announce it so it was a big surprise when one day several pvpers were out on the field holding a large cup of tea and looking snooty. not surprisingly the pvpers were not very happy with the contribution of the art team to pvp life, The roleplayers ofc loved it.
but it was a good while before the pvpers got mad at a new costume pack.

the moral of this story is you do not really know the full impact of what developers are doing or planning , who os working on what, Not all changes preclude others.

if every thing is "balenced" maybe it might be easier to bring in more races or race guilds. if gobbos are more or less on par with others, maybe some of thier guild bans will be removed. if humans our stronger human only guilds may get "balenced" also.

Remember game development is a journey not a destination. the only thing that really "ruins a game" is running off the players and wizards that devote thier time to it.

so both sides should definitely try listen to each other and try to keep positive open minds. what will benefit things. not what ideas you hate. and also keep in mind even if you have every single player wanting something doesn't mean it will happen (often it might prevent that thing, especially if you were told no)

remember we not only do not pay for genesis, we can always Wiz and contribute to the game ourselves. there are various possibilities that do not require programming. if your still in school LPC skills being that C is the backbone of several modern programming languages could lead to a high paying job.

[Ckrik]

if your still in school LPC skills being that C is the backbone of several modern programming languages could lead to a high paying job.

You young'un take note, someone with Ziz's programming and analytical skills (honed through years of programming beyond working a 9-5 job) can command astronomical sums in the job market. We're always looking for the next generation of wizards to keep the game going, so send Cherek an application if you think adding to the game would be fun -- it may even set you on an awesome career path.