Disclosure policy?

Discuss general game topics or anything else that doesn't fit in the other forums
Forum rules
- Use common sense and be respectful towards each other at all times, even when disagreeing.
- Do not reveal sensitive game information. Guild secrets, player seconds are examples of things not allowed.
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Rhaegar
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Rhaegar » 18 May 2010 20:57

The thing is, people seldom do that anymore this days. There were some pioneers back in the day for sure, most of the others just used their work instead of discovering everything themselves.
I'm just talking about giving everyone fair chances and put an end to dealing information 'behind the back'. Also, it's not like most people that are already established players don't know everything if not most of the things that could as well be published.
I fear no evil for I am fear incarnate.

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Mersereau
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Mersereau » 18 May 2010 21:17

Rhaegar wrote: Also, it's not like most people that are already established players don't know everything if not most of the things that could as well be published.
You think so?
"Tragedy is when I cut my finger. Comedy is when you fall into an open sewer and die."
-Mel Brooks

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Rhaegar
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Rhaegar » 18 May 2010 21:19

Yup, that's exactly what I think.
I fear no evil for I am fear incarnate.

Ilrahil

Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Ilrahil » 18 May 2010 21:20

Not going to try to toot my own horn. But I consider myself above average in knowledge of Genesis and I worked for many years to discover quite a few things. Some tricks were taught to me, others I worked out on my own. When the quest orbs came out I made it my personal goal to finish them all and I succeeded (though there are some nowadays that I don't have.) For me and maybe its pride, but giving out all that information to someone would negate a lot of the feelings I have toward genesis. It would mean no one has to test anything anymore, they can just go somewhere and get all the information they want on it, which was why I was against the wiki page.

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Rhaegar
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Rhaegar » 18 May 2010 21:34

I never said anything about disclosing everything to the point where someone is literally 'led by hand'.
I just thought that the list of quests (just the list) as it appears in the globes and more thorough guild info (available trainings, background etc.) should be available on the main website.
It's not a big givaway and new players would benefit from it greatly in my opinion.
I fear no evil for I am fear incarnate.

Ilrahil

Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Ilrahil » 18 May 2010 21:39

The quest list I am not really against giving the names out of the quests. I think that would be a fine idea. The only problem with providing what training guilds have is that in the case of PvP it can reveal certain weakness of a guild that they try hard to make sure don't get out. If available trainings for a member were put into place on the website it could reveal information about spells not known to the public that a guild has or skills/abilities that was unknown. Things elite guilds tend to be elite about for a reason. Not because its overpowered but because they don't want the info to get out.

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Rhaegar
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Rhaegar » 18 May 2010 22:33

Ilrahil wrote:The quest list I am not really against giving the names out of the quests. I think that would be a fine idea. The only problem with providing what training guilds have is that in the case of PvP it can reveal certain weakness of a guild that they try hard to make sure don't get out. If available trainings for a member were put into place on the website it could reveal information about spells not known to the public that a guild has or skills/abilities that was unknown. Things elite guilds tend to be elite about for a reason. Not because its overpowered but because they don't want the info to get out.
I believe that a simple mention like
The Rangers of the Westlands have limited magical abilities available, allowing them to cure wounds and rid body of poison.
or
Dragonarmy officers can summon dragons to aid them in battle or transport them on their backs around the world.
doesn't reveal the full extent of said abilities and isn't anything a player won't get to know after simply asking around in-game.

The reason to put such info on the website would be to make certain guilds/features/world in general more appealing. After all, most people like to know what they're getting into and what can they expect from the game they're about to commit a large amount of time.
I fear no evil for I am fear incarnate.

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gorboth
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by gorboth » 19 May 2010 00:00

My feeling on this is as follows:

Genesis is best experienced as a world that treats itself as a world, not a game that treats itself as a game. In the world, you learn things through interaction with people more experienced than you are. In a game, you read the rulebook, know all the possible moves beforehand, and try to set up a suitable strategy from the outset. In a world, you live a life and pursue goals that suit the role you see yourself playing. In a game, you play to win.

We want to make sure that players who come to Genesis get just enough information to help them feel confident about what they can do and where they can go in terms of "start-up" content. The deep content of the game is best left to be discovered through personal experience, exploration, and what you can learn from others.

This philosophy was taken into account in the creation of the quest orbs. The design tells you how many quests exist in each domain, and provide a hint as to where to look for them. More information than this, in my opinion, takes us too far out of "world" and into "game manual."

Regarding guilds, I have plans to set up a guild liason office in Sparkle. The office will allow the council members of each guild to customize the information available to new players (and old) that will be given out in that office. Some guilds will perhaps choose to share much. Some will choose to share little. Some may choose to share nothing.

This, I feel, is as it should be. Not all guilds are available to all players. Not all guilds *should* be available to all players. Some guilds will hold their cards close to the vest. Others will throw them in your face.

Peripheral knowledge of all guilds is probably a good thing to present to the new players. But this knowledge should definitely not include a short list of available powers. Guilds are institutions for roleplay - not pieces on a chess board to be examined, considered, and moved.

These are my feelings, but I love hearing those of others. Hopefully mine have been backed up with reasons and philosophy that will satisfy those who want more than mere opinion.

G.
Mmmmmm ... pie ...

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Rhaegar
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Rhaegar » 19 May 2010 00:39

I can't help but agree with you Gorboth. And the guild liaison idea is awesome!
I fear no evil for I am fear incarnate.

Velicus
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Re: Disclosure policy?

Post by Velicus » 19 May 2010 03:54

Ilrahil wrote:Or you have views that others do not share. Mers's view is that Genesis is hard work and people should learn and explore things for themselves without having it handed to them on a silver platter. Your view is different. Nothing wrong with disagreeing.
How is mine different? Without knowing it, which you obviously don't, you should feel foolish for making such an assertion.

I agree that people should learn and explore things for themselves, just not that they should be forced to do it entirely or even mostly for themselves. And, as always, it should be enjoyable, not work. Even if you disagree, too late. There are maps, weapons lists, herb lists, etc. both on the web and in the game. People make them are share them because they know such things are useful and can be unpleasant to do entirely yourself. If you want to be a selfish player, obviously that's a bad strategy, but some people really are here to have fun with others.

To agree with Gorboth and my suggestion was to include information in a way that would actually increase the immersion of the game. If you've read Lord of the Rings, there's a good chance you'll be far more entertained by walking through the Shire than someone who has never heard of a hobbit. Similarly, if you go to the library and read about Golthab the Shambling and his pulsating silver sword, ruling over reanimated beasts of Shadowdrop Moor, you'll probably feel a bit more satisfied to find and slay him.

I wanted to hear Mersereau's reasoning because I suspected it would be self-serving... don't give other people anything he chose to work for. But my reasoning stems from what is best for the game. I know as a newbie I used maps, equipment lists, and information others discovered before me and chose to share. I think if I had needed to spend a lot of time performing repetitive tasks like those, I would not have continued playing. Then again, the grinding still exists.

Velicus

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