The rise of the Nameless Horror!

[varian]

I'll also clarify that I am not saying no to the idea of a Khiraa or Khiraa-style guild, and I am not saying we should never make any new occupational guilds. Who knows how the situation will look a year from now, or three years from now, but right NOW it's a no to both Khiraa and other new occupational guild projects. I do encourage wizards to create layman, craft and racial guilds.

Totally agree. And absolutely think we need more crafts

[Drazson]

I haven't experienced this Raumdor terror, sadly, but it sounds like it cannot go through as an Occupational guild because we cannot have more occupationals at the moment.

I assume that it being a non-occupational guild would be a disservice, otherwise a layman option that lore and playerbase can be built upon may not be a bad idea. Or a race/lay if that makes sense?

[Kvator]

Voted no.

Also pls reconsider these vampires I am hearing of lately :/ (make them racial guild or something)

[Mim]

1. I think that it would funnel people out of other elite guilds instead of Mercs and SoHM, which would not be a good thing.

I'm sure you mean I think that it would funnel people out of other guilds instead of elite Mercs and SoHM, don't you?

[Skythus]

[quote=Mim post_id=46768
I'm sure you mean I think that it would funnel people out of other guilds instead of elite Mercs and SoHM, don't you?
[/quote]

I think about FK. People from various elite guilds transferred over. When something is cool enough, you'll give your main to it. I think the largest flight risk is longtime magic users.

[Arman]

Arman,
As stated above, the CoCs have been in development for so long that excluding any option on the grounds that it thematically overlaps with a guild potentially opening in 2030 is simply not valid. At some point the plug must be pulled. Some would say said plug should have been pulled half a decade ago.

Your reluctance to combine layman and occupational and your liking to “free combination of guilds” is well known. I respect your view here, but your view is in direct conflict with 1) the trend of magic guild creation as a whole and 2) the Khiraa’s potential ability to actually exist as a balancing act towards Calia. Also, I disagree on a personal level. I generally hate not dedicating to one concept, and the very thought of a death knight/pirate or death knight/minstrel really turns the stomach. Just.. gross! Eww!

Yes, my view is in direct conflict with the trend of magic guilds. But it is a view that has been formed through hindsight, after working on the recode of the Priests of Takhisis, and then the balance reviews of the Elemental Clerics. Look, I won't disagree of the conflict in my view and the current magic environment... the way I see it now is that the pandoras box was opened with the Morgul Mages recode, with the belief that a workable magic guild could only be done by combining occ and layman. If I had my time again I would look into making them workable as occupational... as I don't feel that their theme is so unique it would not be complemented by existing laymans.

I do get your personal preference for one dedicated player concept though. You are certainly not alone in that view... Gorboth strongly holds it, and his Necromancers certainly are more aligned to your thinking than mine. So I am willing to make exceptions.

And as for the Necromancer's development, I am one of the few with some insight in to how much work has been done on it. Yes, Gorboth works at a glacial pace. But what he creates and has created so far on it is of the highest creative order. It is well advanced, but don't expect it to be released until Gorboth has it to his satisfaction. It will be worth the wait.

[Raelle]

And as for the Necromancer's development, I am one of the few with some insight in to how much work has been done on it. Yes, Gorboth works at a glacial pace. But what he creates and has created so far on it is of the highest creative order. It is well advanced, but don't expect it to be released until Gorboth has it to his satisfaction. It will be worth the wait.

<tingle>

[Skythus]

Specialization increases roleplay imo.

You're a necromancer who has dedicated every ounce of their being into being a master at dark magic. You want to be a lich, you want to gain an army, you want to avoid death.

You're a Cleric who sees undeath as a disease. You vow to rid the world of this unholy blight and attempt to cure those who fought it and lost, to further the cause of your gods.

You're the cleric of an evil god, mouthpiece to the empire. You can guide the armies as you move to conquer the world, using your blessings to strike fear into the hearts of your enemies and awe in your allies.

You're a mage, priding yourself in your knowledge of your respective sorcerery. You have worked for months, if not years, learning what you do, and getting your powers down to a science. You seek to expand your power, unravel the mysteries of the world, and maintain information superiority.

You're a sneak tank that also heals and does magic while sailing and summon a mount. You get you power from a being you have an agreement with but do not serve, are owed a mount because of your bloodline, sail because you have free time. You kill monsters.

I feel like more people want to be their laymans than occs anyway.

[Makfly]

[...] Look, I won't disagree of the conflict in my view and the current magic environment... the way I see it now is that the pandoras box was opened with the Morgul Mages recode, with the belief that a workable magic guild could only be done by combining occ and layman. If I had my time again I would look into making them workable as occupational... as I don't feel that their theme is so unique it would not be complemented by existing laymans.

I do get your personal preference for one dedicated player concept though. You are certainly not alone in that view... Gorboth strongly holds it, and his Necromancers certainly are more aligned to your thinking than mine. So I am willing to make exceptions.
[...]

Your response made me think of a suggestion I have made several times over the decades. Simply that all* layman guilds got the option to turn off their layman title.
That way each layman guild could much better complement current OCC guilds, without being a complete RP clash, which is often the case now. The Shadow Union is but one good example of this, because most layman guilds really clash with their theme and RP foundation, with Sybarus being very insular and with their very own view and culture. Just off the top of my head only the most generic of layman guilds (Blademasters) might make a decent fit without causing a clash.

Never the less, make every layman guild able to hide their layman title, and thus to some degree, your affiliation with it, makes for much better flexibility for the layman to complement the OCC, as you mentioned, and would give a better option for a more dedicated player concept, and in turn roleplaying and sticking in-character within a (perhaps) narrow theme.

*There is always room for an exception, of course.

Another option, which is more boring I think, would be to simply make a layman very of the Mercenaries. That way you get the most generic way to boost your primary skills with no strings or themes imposed on you. But I would much rather prefer the first option.

[Rache]

Never the less, make every layman guild able to hide their layman title, and thus to some degree, your affiliation with it, makes for much better flexibility for the layman to complement the OCC, as you mentioned, and would give a better option for a more dedicated player concept, and in turn roleplaying and sticking in-character within a (perhaps) narrow theme.

I agree with your post. But I believe it starts with identifying the fact that there is a severe lack of attractive layman guilds, and we have for decades. Perhaps with the current attitude from upstairs we might finally be able to rectify that. We've been asking for a Weapon-neutral guild to complement Blademasters. Instead, we got a hard-align locked polearm layman. If the admin is actually willing to address the gaping holes in the layman guilds, your suggestion will make a lot more sense.